I've gotten another jury summons

[Ben Kenobi]

Catholic church maybe Mexico wouldn't be the third world ****hole it is today.

Well then, Mexico dumped the monarchy which is why they are wealthy now. Oh wait. Maybe it wasn't the key to prosperity switching to liberalism and anticlericalism.

[Ban Kenobi]

Would you say that Oklahoma stopped sucking when they brought in the white man?

Well, apparently the United States "liberated" the Native Americans...

Well then, Mexico dumped the monarchy which is why they are wealthy now. Oh wait. Maybe it wasn't the key to prosperity switching to liberalism and anticlericalism.

The damage has already been done. Do you have a better explanation for the divergence between the US and Mexico?

[Ben Kenobi]

Well, apparently the United States "liberated" the Native Americans...

Just as they liberated Texas from the Mexicans, and joined the Confederacy to pursue the cause of freedom and equality for all.

The damage has already been done. Do you have a better explanation for the divergence between the US and Mexico

Yes. Had they kept the Spanish King and the '24 constitution (more liberal than the US at the time), and kept private property rights, and protected the rights of the Church, Mexico would be far more prosperous today. It would own California and likely Texas as well.

Texas rebelled not because they wanted to be Yankee, but because Santa Ana abrogated the Mexican constitution creating a federal republic. Texas, along with other states rebelled, but Texas succeeded where the other states did not.

Had Santa Anna not done so, Texas would have stayed with Mexico. No gold rush, and what if Britain kept Oregon? America would be very different today.

[Al B. Sure!]

Texans also wanted to keep their slaves and not convert to Catholicism.

The Plan of Cuernavaca, published on on 25 May 1834, called for repeal of the liberal reforms.[9] On 12 June, Santa Anna dissolved Congress and announced his decision to adopt the Plan of Cuernavaca.[10] Santa Anna formed a new Catholic, centralist, conservative government which replaced the 1824 constitution with the new constitutional document known as the "Siete Leyes" ("The Seven Laws") of 1835. Santa Anna dissolved the Congress and began centralizing power. The regime became a dictatorship backed by the military.

Several states openly rebelled against the changes: Coahuila y Tejas (the northern part of which would become the Republic of Texas), San Luis Potosí, Querétaro, Durango, Guanajuato, Michoacán, Yucatán, Jalisco, Nuevo León, Tamaulipas, and Zacatecas. Several of these states formed their own governments: the Republic of the Rio Grande, the Republic of Yucatan, and the Republic of Texas. Only the Texans defeated Santa Anna and retained their independence. Their fierce resistance was possibly fueled by reprisals Santa Anna committed against his defeated enemies.[11] The New York Post editorialized that "had [Santa Anna] treated the vanquished with moderation and generosity, it would have been difficult if not impossible to awaken that general sympathy for the people of Texas which now impels so many adventurous and ardent spirits to throng to the aid of their brethren".[12]

Just as they liberated Texas from the Mexicans, and joined the Confederacy to pursue the cause of freedom and equality for all.

Who joined the Confederacy?

[Al B. Sure!]

The damage has already been done. Do you have a better explanation for the divergence between the US and Mexico?

Catholic Iberian cultures seem to be predisposed to corruption and dictatorships. Spain and Portugal have only been democracies since the 1970's and Latin America is notorious for dictatorships.

I think Protestant Anglo culture has had liberalizing influences going back to the Anglo-Saxons that were never present in Catholic Iberia. The pre-1066 English had an elective monarchy and their successors would develop a parliament, depose a king, develop a strong and powerful middle class, etc. while medieval Spain was a militaristic agricultural society with a fanatical Catholic base shaped by the reconquista and the counter-reformation/inquisition.

Just as some argue that present Arab society is not amiable to liberal democracies, Latin culture has demonstrated for centuries that it is not amiable to it, either. The fact that much of the Latin world has become more democratized in the past few decades is testament to the possibility for adaptation, however.

[MRT144]

Catholic Iberian cultures seem to be predisposed to corruption and dictatorships. Spain and Portugal have only been democracies since the 1970's and Latin America is notorious for dictatorships.

I think Protestant Anglo culture has had liberalizing influences going back to the Anglo-Saxons that were never present in Catholic Iberia. The pre-1066 English had an elective monarchy and their successors would develop a parliament, depose a king, develop a strong and powerful middle class, etc. while medieval Spain was a militaristic agricultural society with a fanatical Catholic base shaped by the reconquista and the counter-reformation/inquisition.

Just as some argue that present Arab society is not amiable to liberal democracies, Latin culture has demonstrated for centuries that it is not amiable to it, either. The fact that much of the Latin world has become more democratized in the past few decades is testament to the possibility for adaptation, however.

When are you going to start your newsletter?

[Elok]

Clearly Spain is anti-freedom because of the centuries of Muslim rule. That's the common thread here, after all.

[Al B. Sure!]

Clearly Spain is anti-freedom because of the centuries of Muslim rule. That's the common thread here, after all.

Agricultural economies dominated by large landowners combined with strong clerical power tends to stunt the development of the bourgeoisie necessary for the foundation of capitalist democracy. Add in the militarism of being on the march between the Christian world and the Islamic and then the pagans of the Americas and you have the recipe for cultural traditions that lend themselves to dictatorship.

The more progressive nations of Europe (in Scandinavia, the Netherlands, and England) notably lacked the emphasis on large-scale land ownership, strong clerical power, and militarism so present in the Iberian kingdoms.

[Ben Kenobi]

Who joined the Confederacy?

The same folks that apparently lifted TX from being a terrible place.

[Al B. Sure!]

The same folks that apparently lifted TX from being a terrible place.

And who is that?

[C0ckney]

The more progressive nations of Europe (in Scandinavia, the Netherlands, and England) notably lacked the emphasis on large-scale land ownership, strong clerical power, and militarism so present in the Iberian kingdoms.

the UK always had, and still has a very unequal distribution of land. a tiny percentage of the population owns a very large percentage of the land.

[Al B. Sure!]

the UK always had, and still has a very unequal distribution of land. a tiny percentage of the population owns a very large percentage of the land.

But the economy and power structure were not centered on large landowners to the extent of other nations. England had a flourishing middle class in the Middle Ages and was a trading power.

[Imran Siddiqui]

And what exactly do you mean the lack of strong clerical power in England or Sweden? Don't treat the rise of atheism of those countries today as meaning the church wasn't very powerful in the past.

[Al B. Sure!]

And what exactly do you mean the lack of strong clerical power in England or Sweden? Don't treat the rise of atheism of those countries today as meaning the church wasn't very powerful in the past.

The Protestant Reformation is what I mean. It didn't just happen. The Church's influence had long been waning and came to a head with the complete repudiation of the Church in the 16th century. Congregationalist Protestantism is pretty non-clerical, don't you think?

[Imran Siddiqui]

So you really mean the lack of strong CATHOLIC power after the Reformation?

Because prior to Henry VIII's break, the Catholic Church was ridiculously powerful. Cardinal Wolsey basically ran the country for Henry and Henry was named Defender of the Faith.