The Gold Plated Ambulance

[Ben Kenobi]

Someone who spends years sitting trying to take care of someone who they deeply love but who is totally unresponsive.. ****, it's impossible to understand how hard and incredibly lonely that must be. I'm not in the least surprised that he fell in love again, and I hope he has a very happy life as a result.

And we have a vote for "yes I would cheat on my wife". Thanks Kentonio.

[kentonio]

And we have a vote for "yes I would cheat on my wife". Thanks Kentonio.

I wouldn't blame anyone for finding some comfort after years of caring for someone who is brain dead. If he'd have sat by her side for the next 40 years then it would have been two lives wasted instead of just one. If Mrs Schiavo loved him, then it seems incredibly unlikely that she'd have wanted him to spend his life in misery like that.

[Ben Kenobi]

She'd be more pissed at me for not following her instructions.

So the cheating wouldn't bother her then, I take it.

You are really an idiot. But again legally it was immaterial.

I'm an idiot for stating that you should stay with your wife even when she's sick?

Only in your opinion.

Sinking your former ship with all hands is apparently the way to go these days.

I thought ROE help the top spot with you.

I said one of.

[kentonio]

So the cheating wouldn't bother her then, I take it.

It's a shame you don't realize how powerful love can actually be. If you really love someone it's not about what they can do for you, its about what you can do for them. Sometimes that means you'd rather they went on without you and found happiness than sat and suffered.

[Ben Kenobi]

I wouldn't blame anyone for finding some comfort after years of caring for someone who is brain dead.

Again, she wasn't brain dead. What you are saying is that someone who loses some brain function is no longer 'there' and you no longer have any duty to care for them. This would include dementia patients, Alzheimer's, etc.

If he'd have sat by her side for the next 40 years then it would have been two lives wasted instead of just one.

Interesting. So you think that caring for a wife for 40 years, staying by her side the entire time - looking after her and her needs without anything in return is a wasted life. I beg to differ.

If Mrs Schiavo loved him, then it seems incredibly unlikely that she'd have wanted him to spend his life in misery like that.

Why then cut the cord? If you sincerely believe you are 'wasting your life' caring for another person, why not just leave?

[Ben Kenobi]

If you really love someone it's not about what they can do for you, its about what you can do for them.

Yet,

If he'd have sat by her side for the next 40 years then it would have been two lives wasted instead of just one.

So the best thing that a person who suffers loss of brain function can do is just get on with dying so that others can live their own life?

No wonder you're supportive of helping the process along if it isn't happening quickly enough.

[kentonio]

Again, she wasn't brain dead. What you are saying is that someone who loses some brain function is no longer 'there' and you no longer have any duty to care for them. This would include dementia patients, Alzheimer's, etc.

She was basically brain dead, stop trying to make out as if she was just 'sick'. She was a vegetable and was going to stay that way for the rest of her life.

Interesting. So you think that caring for a wife for 40 years, staying by her side the entire time - looking after her and her needs without anything in return is a wasted life. I beg to differ.

Of course you do, you have zero experience of real relationships. Sitting by the bedside of an unresponsive person for decades is not a life.

Why then cut the cord? If you sincerely believe you are 'wasting your life' caring for another person, why not just leave?

Probably because he loved her back, and instead of just taking the easy way out of just walking away, he wanted to give her release. Again, I don't expect you to understand that.

[kentonio]

So the best thing that a person who suffers loss of brain function can do is just get on with dying so that others can live their own life?

I don't know anyone personally who would want to live like that for any length of time. Most of my family have said that they'd want to die if it ever came to anything like that.

[Elok]

When BK meets That Special Someone, he'll ask her, "would you be okay with marriage to a brain-dead person?" And she'll ask him, "Are you proposing, honey?"


(sorry, couldn't resist)

[Ben Kenobi]

When BK meets That Special Someone, he'll ask her, "would you be okay with marriage to a brain-dead person?" And she'll ask him, "Are you proposing, honey?"

No, he'll ask her, "How did you come to know so much about the Catholic church?"

[Ben Kenobi]

I don't know anyone personally who would want to live like that for any length of time. Most of my family have said that they'd want to die if it ever came to anything like that.

It should never become the duty for them to do so. I don't think caring for someone incapable of caring for themselves is a waste. Far from it. What else are you going to do that is more important to your life than caring for the one you love more than any other?

She was basically brain dead, stop trying to make out as if she was just 'sick'. She was a vegetable and was going to stay that way for the rest of her life.

There's a big difference between 'all dead', and 'mostly dead', just as there is between where Terri was at and being brain dead. If she were brain dead, she would be on a respirator.

Of course you do, you have zero experience of real relationships. Sitting by the bedside of an unresponsive person for decades is not a life.

You were asking me, "how do I know about love"? Apparently more than you. Yes, it is a life, and no, it is not a wasted one.

Probably because he loved her back, and instead of just taking the easy way out of just walking away, he wanted to give her release.

So it's ok to kill someone because you wanted to release them from pain?

[kentonio]

It should never become the duty for them to do so. I don't think caring for someone incapable of caring for themselves is a waste. Far from it. What else are you going to do that is more important to your life than caring for the one you love more than any other?

It's all just idealistic bull**** to you. I hope one day you grow up a bit about this stuff.

[Ben Kenobi]

It's all just idealistic bull**** to you. I hope one day you grow up a bit about this stuff.

No, it's not. I've seen people like this and I know people who have done this. I can only hope to be as strong as they.

[Ben Kenobi]

Ben will never cheat on his wife, because at this rate he's never likely to have one - thank God!

This announcement brought to you by Moby, husband for, ? years.

[Berzerker]

Is there a piece of paper, written down, anywhere, where Terri Schiavo states that in the event of her incapacitation, she wants to die?

None that I know of, just the word of her husband and others aware of her wishes. Is there a piece of paper saying she wants to live in that situation and hold her husband to his vow until he or she dies? A marriage vow gets trumped by the wishes of the married - its called an amendment. I dont know why you're bringing the state into this, it wasn't mentioned in the Garden when Adam and Eve were told about their roles as husband and wife. And you forgot they trump the folks according to the same story. You used those verses to accuse polygamists of sin - including Jesus' fathers - and now you ignore them to hand the spouse's authority over to the parents.

What of them? People who are starving should be fed. Especially when they are helpless and unable to feed themselves.

And that includes ignoring the wishes of people who become brain dead? Our 95 year old grandmother refuses to eat, lets force feed her? I think you're taking that out of context.

The same Michael who cheated on his wife while she was still alive, and took up another woman to replace her? You cite 'biblical principles' and then blithely ignore Michael's violation of his own marital union.

The Bible shows guys "cheating" without condemnation from God - like Abraham and other patriarchs with multiple wives and concubines. So his alleged cheating aint the issue, its following her instructions, following his "duty" to her. Why didn't he just walk away or let the family take over? That would have been the easy thing to do, right? No, he fought to pull the plug - maybe he was telling the truth about what she wanted. You said it yourself, he took the road that angered everyone. And he did it for her...

I asked this before and you wouldn't answer, when did this "cheating" happen? If it was more than a decade after his wife's brain stopped working, then you are ignoring the decade he gave to her. By then she was presumed dead and "if" she did not want to be left in that situation, he acted according to her wishes.

What would you do if you were him? She wants to die and you're keeping her alive and angering everyone when you give up and follow her instructions. You think he did that for ****s and giggles? I think he gave her time and lost hope she'd recover, apparently 8 years before starting the process of ending her life - and that took another 7 years. So when did this cheating occur? After he gave up hope or before?

She wasn't brain dead. Brain dead people are on respirators.

easier to type than permanent vegetative state or whatever they called it

When did she ask Michael to do that for her? Are you saying that Terri Schiavo wasn't brain dead and could speak to make her wishes clear to Michael?

Before her brain trauma

Why is it agony, Berz?

Losing someone to brain death is not agony? Years of being torn between their desire to end it and the hope for their recovery would be agony for me and it would be for you too. Right?

Right?

I'd damn well prefer that she move on and **** her new lover rather than killing me on her way out the door.

And what if you told her not to leave you in that situation?

Being a person with a disability, I changed my will after the Schiavo execution. In the event of incapacitation - I am to be given all basic treatment, including food and water.

You could be saving people in need of organs

Would you be ****ing another woman and have two kids on the go with her while your wife was incapacitated?

At his age, I'd hope so. If he wants children he'd better have them before he gets too old.

"Honey, if I'm ever brain dead just keep me alive as long as possible and dont remarry and have children because you belong to me".

Those are the words you're putting into Terri Schiavo's mouth.