Ben's Bankruptcy sweepstakes!

[Ben Kenobi]

1. I don't know your exact citizenship status. I'm just saying that you don't understand key principles to being an American.

As I asked before, what exactly do you believe are the key principles to being an American?

I am presently here on a work permit which my employer extends. I've applied for change of status to a Permanent Resident, which is pending.

2. Most Americans don't actually spend a lot of time hating countries that are supposed to be our allies. So if you hate Canada that does not qualify you as American nor prove your loyalty to the U.S.

I was referring to Canadians hating Americans. I never said anything about Americans hating other countries. Most Americans don't care about 'other countries' existence.

3. You love the U.S., are apparently conservative, apparently wave the flag and cheer for the U.S. in war BUT have not put on the Uniform. Hmmm.

I'm ineligible both on the Canadian side and American side as I have a disability. Both my eyes and ears fail to reach the standard. Not much I can do there.

4. I LOVE the U.S., I am a liberal and have served 20 years in the U.S. Navy and another 4 as a Police Officer. I Love the U.S. I am a liberal.

Cool. Like I said, you're on the same list as Tuberski. Someone who's put your ass on the line. I have no quarrel with folks like you. I do have a quarrel with the punks who disrespect folks like you. And I have seen it. I don't like that very much.

5. You have been misinformed about how liberals feel on service members.

I did not even say, "all liberals feel this way". All I said is that the majority of those who attack servicemembers and veterans are liberals.

6. Based on my 4th point and the fact that several presidents served in the military and other prominent service members have been democrats/liberals Ben should love liberals.

Again, remember, I was in Canada. I was treated to shots of the Vietnam war and my teachers gushing over the protesters.

The guiding principles about being and American is that this a melting pot of individuals and states with different backgrounds and ideals that have decided to come together and in unity become stronger than any individual part. The United States of America.

So the only principle that you believe is American is 'diversity' is strength? That's not a very long list.

We must, indeed, all hang together or, most assuredly, we shall all hang separately. - Benjamin Franklin
A house divided against itself cannot stand. - Abraham Lincoln

I have a bit of a longer list.

My list:

Liberty.
The American Dream.
The pursuit of happiness.
Inalienable natural rights.
The Common Law.
Rights and responsibilities (ie, we have the right to do things, but we do so in a responsible manner).
Separation of powers..
Division of the armed forces.
Independent judiciary.
Marriage between one man and one woman.
Freedom of Religion.
Market capitalism.
Guns.
What I like to call the 'Cowboy Code'. Look it up.
Private property.
Federalism.
All people are created equal.
Due process clause, "people shall not be deprived of life or liberty.
The ability to walk into HEB and pick up a 2 litre of Big Red along with a six pack at 2am and nobody even bats an eye.

[giblets]

What I like to call the 'Cowboy Code'. Look it up.

Is this something from Brokeback Mountain? I've never seen it.

[MrFun]

My list:

Liberty.
The American Dream.
The pursuit of happiness.
Inalienable natural rights.
The Common Law.
Rights and responsibilities (ie, we have the right to do things, but we do so in a responsible manner).
Separation of powers..
Division of the armed forces.
Independent judiciary.
Marriage between one man and one woman.
Freedom of Religion.
Market capitalism.
Guns.
What I like to call the 'Cowboy Code'. Look it up.
Private property.
Federalism.
All people are created equal.
Due process clause, "people shall not be deprived of life or liberty.
The ability to walk into HEB and pick up a 2 litre of Big Red along with a six pack at 2am and nobody even bats an eye.

Yet you want to deny gay people their liberty, and their pursuit of happiness.

[Ben Kenobi]

Yet you want to deny gay people their liberty, and their pursuit of happiness.

So you honestly believe that one cannot be free without marriage? I am strongly against rewriting the Common Law which has been in existence long before the constitution. Perhaps you believe that it's American to ditch everything in the past, but I do not.

[Ben Kenobi]

Is this something from Brokeback Mountain? I've never seen it.

There's apparently an invention called google. Perhaps you should check it out. www.google.com/

[giblets]

I'm not googling any gay cowboy stuff.

[Pax]

It's divisive to raise the point that the majority of those who disrespect veterans are liberals? I would say that it's divisive that they are attacking the men and women who serve America. Pointing out their bull**** isn't divisive. That they engage in this bull**** is.

Let's say that your statement is true....This is statement is also true. The majority of liberals respect veterans.

[giblets]

GOP Voted Against 7 Bills to Help Veterans

Here's the Bills in numerical order. In short, the GOP has voted TO NOT SUPPORT THE TROOPS at least 7 times. I think that is sufficient to call the GOP House Hypocrites and Phonies.

Bill's Blocked By Republican's Since President Obama Took Office.

David Gregory, John McCain, and the media aren't covering this story so we have to.

Here's a concise extraction for easy viewing for those who are INTERESTED IN VETERANS ISSUES and need to know which party supports veterans and which party does not.

The rejected Bills are named:

H.R. 466 – Wounded Veteran Job Security Act became H. R. 2875.

H.R. 1168 -- Veterans Retraining Act

H.R. 1171 – Homeless Veterans Reintegration Program Reauthorization

H.R. 1172 -- Requiring List on VA Website of Organizations Providing Scholarships for Veterans

H.R. 1293 -- Disabled Veterans Home Improvement and Structural Alteration Grant Increase Act of 2009

H.R. 1803 -- Veterans Business Center Act

H.R. 2352 – Job Creation Through Entrepreneurship Act

DETAILS OF BILLS REJECTED BY REPUBLICANS:

H.R. 466 – Wounded Veteran Job Security Act – This bill would actually provide job security for veterans who are receiving medical treatment for injuries suffered while fighting in defense of their country. It would prohibit employers from terminating
employees who miss work while receiving treatment for a service-related disability.

H.R. 1168 -- Veterans Retraining Act – This bill would provide for assistance to help veterans who are currently unemployed with their expenses while retraining for the current job market.

H.R. 1171 – Homeless Veterans Reintegration Program Reauthorization – This bill would reauthorize programs in support of homeless veterans, to assist them with job training, counseling, and placement services through the Department of Veterans Affairs through 2014.

H.R. 1172 -- Requiring List on VA Website of Organizations Providing Scholarships for Veterans which does nothing more than direct the Department of Veterans Affairs to include information about scholarships for veterans.

H.R. 1293 -- Disabled Veterans Home Improvement and Structural Alteration Grant Increase Act of 2009 – Here’sanother bill in support of those who have fought for their country, passed by House Democrats and blocked from becoming law by Republicans.

This would increase the amount paid by the VA to disabled veterans for necessary home structural improvements from $4,100 to $6,800 for those who are more than 50% disabled, and from $1,200 to $2,000 who are less than 50%, disabled. This means, if a veteran lost the use of his legs in service of his country, the country will pay for the wheelchair ramp so that he can live at home.

By the way, the last time this ceiling was lifted was in 1992. There isn't even a fiscal reason for being against this bill, as the total cost of this bill, according to CBO estimates, would be a “whopping” $20 million. That's about a quarter (25 cents) per family of four.

H.R. 1803 -- Veterans Business Center Act – This bill would set up a Veterans Business Center program within the Small Business Administration, which would specialize in such programs as grants for service-disabled veterans, help them develop business plans and secure business opportunities. In other words, folks, it would create jobs and offer opportunities those who have fought in defense of our country.

H.R. 2352 – Job Creation Through Entrepreneurship Act – This bill essentially combines a number of other bills that Republicans had blocked in the Senate previously, and adds a few elements. The bill would again establish a Veterans Business Center Program; .... it would establish a Military Entrepreneurs Program; ...

VOTERS NEED TO SEE THIS LIST to offset the distortions offered by the GOP and the silent media.

This GOP record does not says We Do Not Support the Troops.

Is it any wonder that VETERANS SUPPORT OBAMA in recent polls?

Those liberals in the GOP should stop disrespecting veterans

[Pax]

Your list is basically chaff. It creates a diversion from the actual point of this matter. We could bring up a lot different aspects about the U.S. but the core value of being an American is that we stick together whether left or right.

Codes are good Cowboy Code, Samurai Code, Morse Code. We all need a code to live by.

So you left Canada in the 90s or 2000s because Canadians citizens did not support the Vietnam War. You must have been seething in kindergarten.

[Ben Kenobi]

Your list is basically chaff.

Right. The declaration of independence is mere 'chaff'.

And I'm the one who's 'not an American'? It seems I have more respect for American principles than you do.

As for the bit about buying beer at 2am. You CAN'T do that in Canada. At least in BC - beer and wine is controlled by the provincial seller. The province is the only one who can sell beer and liquor. Yes, you heard that right.

It creates a diversion from the actual point of this matter.

The things I cited are all fundamental parts of American democracy.

We could bring up a lot different aspects about the U.S. but the core value of being an American is that we stick together whether left or right.

Taking up arms against brother and sister states as Lincoln did is not 'sticking together'. Even the Canadian understands this.

So you left Canada because Canadians citizens did not support the Vietnam War. You must have been seething in kindergarten.

*sigh*. I said that my teachers cheered on the protestors, and smeared the servicemen. At the time I would have said that I believed the same. It is only after I had a chance to travel to America that I realized things were different than I had been taught (and that, once again, I'd been fed quite a bit of bull**** about America).

[Ben Kenobi]

Let's say that your statement is true....This is statement is also true. The majority of liberals respect veterans.

So you're willing to concede that the majority of folks attacking the military and American servicemen are liberals?

[Pax]

"2. Most people who actually love America, fly the flag, love patriotism and cheer for America in a war are conservatives. Who puts on the uniform? Conservatives. Who express pride and thankfulness towards the servicemen who devote their lives to America? Conservatives.
I did not even say, "all liberals feel this way". All I said is that the majority of those who attack servicemembers and veterans are liberals." - Ben Kenobi
The majority of americans don't demonstrate/public rallies for anything. The silent majority. So even if persons protesting a war happen to be majority democrat that does not mean that the majority of democrats protest a war. For example, after Pearl Harbor/911/the maine/etc Americans come together and kick some ass.
Also the divide between democrats and republicans in service is not 99 to 1, it's more like 60/40 so both democrats and republicans are needed to make the machine run.
I was born and raised in the U.S. there is not a lot of war protesting going here. I would say that what's more important than flags waving is actually showing veterans they are appreciated by getting some of those bills passed.

[Pax]

So you're willing to concede that the majority of folks attacking the military and American servicemen are liberals?

I'm willing to concede that if someone is protesting the war, they are more likely to be on the left than right. I'm also willing to concede that if someone is in a Militia or sovereign citizen (what I consider ARMED open secessionist, rebellion and general treason) they are most likely on the right. Between the two, I am more worried about the guy on the right.

[regexcellent]

Hey Ben, what if I told you that the military is actually just another government agency and suffers all of the same problems that they all do, except that the employees are indentured servants?

[Pax]

I am also conceding that protesting a war is not unpatriotic.