So about that abortion thing..

[regexcellent]

Tell us how fusing a human sperm cell and a human egg instantly creates a person.

That is not what he is saying.

Even if it is, kentonio is still being retarded.

[kentonio]

Then I read posts like the one right above by Kent, and I think 'wow, how can he think such a thing?'.

There was a bit of hyperbole in there, but basically that's exactly what a lot of women feel about this. They hear men telling them that they should be forced to go through the physical and mental trauma of childbirth against their will, and damn right that makes them angry. It brings back memories of a time when women did not have control over their own bodies and were completely under the control of a dominant patriarchal society. If you ignore that, you ignore a huge part of the abortion debate.

[kentonio]

Arguing with Kentonio on abortion is like talking to a brick wall. Really, I'd just like him to acknowledge that murdering babies is not okay. Just that. Not that fetuses are moral people or any of that stuff, but that if I take a 1-month-old baby and stab him, that there isn't an excuse for that.

Then I'd like to see him apply that logic to babies one day from being born.

But I don't think he knows how.

Of course if you'd ever bothered to ask, you'd know that I do not support very late term elective abortions, but it's far easier to assume you know my positions in advance I suppose.

[regexcellent]

You have yet to acknowledge the whole "killing people is bad" thing, and that because killing people is bad what women think is irrelevant once you consider the fetus a person. Once you acknowledge that, we can move on.

[Felch]

Tell us how fusing a human sperm cell and a human egg instantly creates a person.

Personhood is a legal matter. Corporations are people after all.

When two gametes join they create a new organism. If the organism is human, then it is a human being, and it is entitled to basic human rights. I don't see how this is hard to understand. I realize that some people are made uncomfortable by the implications, and so they try to pretend like a human embryo is somehow not human, but that is fanciful. A human embryo can only grow into a human adult (assuming it doesn't die beforehand). It's never going to become a monkey, or dog, or toad, or tree. It is human, through and through.

I understand that not everybody agrees with me, but I don't really care. Nobody so far has been able to persuade me that a human embryo is not human.

[Ben Kenobi]

MikeH - so your argument against me is that I understated my own study in your favour? That's... not helping your case. Even if we blame it on low income - shouldn't we be steering these high risk people away from abortion for their own mental health?

[giblets]

Personhood is a legal matter. Corporations are people after all.

When two gametes join they create a new organism. If the organism is human, then it is a human being, and it is entitled to basic human rights. I don't see how this is hard to understand. I realize that some people are made uncomfortable by the implications, and so they try to pretend like a human embryo is somehow not human, but that is fanciful. A human embryo can only grow into a human adult (assuming it doesn't die beforehand). It's never going to become a monkey, or dog, or toad, or tree. It is human, through and through.

I understand that not everybody agrees with me, but I don't really care. Nobody so far has been able to persuade me that a human embryo is not human.

Why exactly should anyone care about a human organism that lacks a functional nervous system? It's a philosophical zombie. A human organism is only worth caring about if it has a 'soul'.

[Hauldren Collider]

I've always been confused why pro-Life people also tend to be pro-Death Penalty and pro-Standyourground-law.

And also anti-government assistance. All of these poor people getting abortions because they can't afford to raise children are going to need a lot of state assistance. Maybe universal daycare, so the mother can work to feed her kids? Maybe more food stamps and welfare payments?

Also anti-universal health care. Human lives are so ****ing sacred they force everyone to fend for themselves.

I don't think they think through the ramifications of what they advocate.

And I don't think you think at all. If you did, you'd immediately recognize the obvious difference between not having government subsidies and allowing murder. And the difference between a judicial punishment and allowing murder.

[regexcellent]

Asher's post there is obviously a troll since he has, if I recall, in the past criticized Quebec's universal child care.

[Asher]

And I don't think you think at all. If you did, you'd immediately recognize the obvious difference between not having government subsidies and allowing murder. And the difference between a judicial punishment and allowing murder.

Banning all abortions --> increase in birthrate --> more unwanted children (many of which are born into poverty) --> no increase in government subsidies (orphanages, foster homes, food stamps/welfare, daycare for working mothers, etc)?

Where do all those kids go, HC? Who raises them and under what conditions?

Pro-Life people are socialists. It is known. They want the government to dictate what you do with your body, and they want the government to raise those unwanted children. Evil socialists.

[Asher]

Asher's post there is obviously a troll since he has, if I recall, in the past criticized Quebec's universal child care.

Universal child care

[Hauldren Collider]

Asher's debate "strategy" consists of strawmen, non-sequiturs and oxymorons...

[Asher]

Asher's debate "strategy" consists of strawmen, non-sequiturs and oxymorons...

Says the man who refuses to answer a simple question and does nothing but use ad hominems.

[Guynemer]

[Hauldren Collider]

Says the man who refuses to answer a simple question and does nothing but use ad hominems.

Only with you. You're not interesting to talk to because you don't actually participate. You just shout I BELIEVE X AND PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE Y ARE STUPID! HYPOCRITES BECAUSE X IS RIGHT AND Y IS WRONG.