Why do you hate Secular Humanism?

[Kidlicious]

That it "bugs" you shows intolerance.

I only point it out because I'd like to see more tolerance and understanding between beliefs, not because it bothers me.

But how, as a Buddhist, say that I'm wrong?

[HalfLotus]

Buddhists certainly differentiate between right and wrong. The precepts, our moral code, are the bedrock of Buddhism.

What you are displaying is anger (and delusion, in the Buddhist sense) toward other beliefs. Both of which are incorrect responses to a difference of belief, from a Buddhist POV.

There is a point, when an enlightened Buddhist has moved beyond all greed, anger, and delusion, where right and wrong become 'obsolete', so to speak. But we are obviously not there yet.

A Buddhist can judge - if his intentions are good, and his delivery is respectful.

[Elok]

1) Buddhist (including DL) say nothing exists (their language)

Yes, in the same sense that we Christians "believe in one," our words. You just have to ignore the part where we go on "...god, the father almighty, maker of heaven and earth," and voila, we're monists. You're oversimplifying here.

2) In order to exist a thing has to be an independant entity.

Says who? A crossroads exists as nothing more than the intersection of two roads. The universe, they say, is a crossroads of energies--made of motions, not things. It's a confusing way to think of things for us, but it's how they see it. And it's not like our Trinity makes a lot of sense to any human mind either.

3) What are you, a Buddhist now. Good night! When are you ever a christian, or are you?

I'm a Christian who took an Eastern Religions class in college, in addition to chatting up a number of Buddhists. Not seeing why you're allowed to make claims about Buddhism but I'm not. I'm not even going to try to get into Hinduism because I know less about it. Also it's an extremely diverse faith, as you might expect from something believed by around a billion people. Just checked Wikipedia, and it seems there are Hindu schools for every possible opinion about god, including atheism and agnosticism.

[Kidlicious]

Buddhists certainly differentiate between right and wrong. The precepts, our moral code, are the bedrock of Buddhism.

What you are displaying is anger (and delusion, in the Buddhist sense) toward other beliefs. Both of which are incorrect responses to a difference of belief, from a Buddhist POV.

There is a point, when an enlightened Buddhist has moved beyond all greed, anger, and delusion, where right and wrong become 'obsolete', so to speak. But we are obviously not there yet.

A Buddhist can judge - if his intentions are good, and his delivery is respectful.

I'm not angry. I said I was "bugged" and that was probably an overstatement. I want you to know the joy of having faith in god. It's nice to not have negative emotions, but there's more for you to have, great joy, that only comes from god.

[HalfLotus]

I'm so glad that you experience joy. I would disagree with your last statement though. My study and practice of Buddhism has brought me great joy, with no god (that I know of).

But perhaps we speak of different joys.

[Elok]

Now that I think of it, why the dickens did my Eastern Religions class not mention Sikhs?

[loinburger]

Maybe there aren't enough of them

[Kidlicious]

Yes, in the same sense that we Christians "believe in one," our words. You just have to ignore the part where we go on "...god, the father almighty, maker of heaven and earth," and voila, we're monists. You're oversimplifying here.



Says who? A crossroads exists as nothing more than the intersection of two roads. The universe, they say, is a crossroads of energies--made of motions, not things. It's a confusing way to think of things for us, but it's how they see it. And it's not like our Trinity makes a lot of sense to any human mind either.



I'm a Christian who took an Eastern Religions class in college, in addition to chatting up a number of Buddhists. Not seeing why you're allowed to make claims about Buddhism but I'm not. I'm not even going to try to get into Hinduism because I know less about it. Also it's an extremely diverse faith, as you might expect from something believed by around a billion people. Just checked Wikipedia, and it seems there are Hindu schools for every possible opinion about god, including atheism and agnosticism.

I have an individual consciousness. I'm not more sure of anything else. I'm certain that it's not at all a part of either your consciousness or that of a tree. In fact I have no way of knowing that either you or a tree have a consciousness. Beyond that I have faith in what I believe, but I'm certain that my consciousness is independant of you.

Regarding Hindu dieties, as far as I know there is nothing that prevents a Hindu from believing whatever they please.

[Elok]

I guess I should give the teacher credit for squeezing both schools of Buddhism, the basics of Hinduism, Taoism, Confucius and even a little about Shinto into one semester. But dang, what I know about Sikhs is fun. A kind of minimalist, pacifist monotheism. Might be interesting to talk with a Sufi too.

[Kidlicious]

I'm so glad that you experience joy. I would disagree with your last statement though. My study and practice of Buddhism has brought me great joy, with no god (that I know of).

But perhaps we speak of different joys.

I think that we do, because I believe that god loves me very much, and that I am an individual being.

[Elok]

I have an individual consciousness. I'm not more sure of anything else. I'm certain that it's not at all a part of either your consciousness or that of a tree. In fact I have no way of knowing that either you or a tree have a consciousness. Beyond that I have faith in what I believe, but I'm certain that my consciousness is independant of you.

And IIUC the Buddhist says your consciousness is in fact a kind of illusion. Nor is it really independent from even a Christian POV. The things I say or do can and do have an effect on your consciousness, and vice versa.

Regarding Hindu dieties, as far as I know there is nothing that prevents a Hindu from believing whatever they please.

Only in the sense that everyone on earth has freedom of conscience (though some may die for it). Some types of Hinduism are highly conservative, and all of them have very specific beliefs to follow. If you belong to a sect that says Vishnu is the supreme deity, you can't believe that Shiva trumps Vishnu; if you do, you're no longer a member of that sect, but of another sect of Hinduism. Now, it is true, from what I can tell, that Hinduism is sufficiently diverse to offer a sect for almost every preference. But the same is true of Christianity these days. There are literally thousands of denominations.

[Kidlicious]

And IIUC the Buddhist says your consciousness is in fact a kind of illusion. Nor is it really independent from even a Christian POV. The things I say or do can and do have an effect on your consciousness, and vice versa.

Now you're contradicting yourself like a true buddhist. If neither one of us has an individual consciousness, how can you affect mine? Accordiing to you, neither exist. It's all one consciousness

At any rate, my environment affects me. I didnt say otherwise. Whether or not you are an indepen df ent self affecting me is something else. But has nothing to do with my knowledge of myself.

%

Only in the sense that everyone on earth has freedom of conscience (though some may die for it). Some types of Hinduism are highly conservative, and all of them have very specific beliefs to follow. If you belong to a sect that says Vishnu is the supreme deity, you can't believe that Shiva trumps Vishnu; if you do, you're no longer a member of that sect, but of another sect of Hinduism. Now, it is true, from what I can tell, that Hinduism is sufficiently diverse to offer a sect for almost every preference. But the same is true of Christianity these days. There are literally thousands of denominations.

I think you're wrong. Hindus dont think of other Hindus as wrong in the same way that I think you are, but if they do they arent good hindus, and they dont bug me so much.

[Elok]

So, you're mostly bugged by Hindus who don't dislike other Hindus?

[Kidlicious]

I don't dislike people who disagree with me. They only bug me if they dont make sense.

[Elok]

Also, here:

Now you're contradicting yourself like a true buddhist. If neither one of us has an individual consciousness, how can you affect mine? Accordiing to you, neither exist. It's all one consciousness

1. I never said we didn't have individual consciousness, I said that even from a Christian POV, we're not really totally independent. IE, I wasn't talking about Buddhism there.
2. I never said "it's all one consciousness." That's not even Buddhist, it's more Hindu, and even they (possibly with some exceptions) believe in an individual soul as well. Albeit the idea is to realize that atman, the individual soul, is in some sense one with brahman, the big cosmic soul.