Social Security- a "ponzi scheme?"

[Ben Kenobi]

Seems like the most fair/'conservative' welfare system I've ever heard of... after all, normal welfare/AFDC/etc. is based on NOT working. At least Social Security is based on actually having worked in the past...

Then make it voluntary to participate. Problem solved. If it's a 'fair' system, then why does it force people to pay into it?

[C0ckney]

why not make all taxes voluntary, after all, how can any tax be fair if people are forced to pay it.

[Kuciwalker]

Why are you morons still playing the definition game? (those of you asserting that SS is or is not a ponzi scheme) The only purpose you can have in asserting that it is would be to go "SS is a ponzi scheme, ponzi schemes are bad, ergo SS is bad" but we can independently figure out whether SS is bad without deciding whether it's a ponzi scheme. It a stupid rhetorical trick that doesn't even work very well, and it's intellectually dishonest.

[Provost Harrison]

How the hell is social security a Ponzi scheme...not seeing it. Really, your American right-wing rhetoric is pretty crap.

[DaShi]

Good thread, Zevico.

[Aeson]

Why are you morons still playing the definition game? (those of you asserting that SS is or is not a ponzi scheme) The only purpose you can have in asserting that it is would be to go "SS is a ponzi scheme, ponzi schemes are bad, ergo SS is bad" but we can independently figure out whether SS is bad without deciding whether it's a ponzi scheme. It a stupid rhetorical trick that doesn't even work very well, and it's intellectually dishonest.

The most obvious reason to deal with the label is that it was the topic of the article, and something a presidential candidate said. The comparison between SS and a ponzi scheme is thus not just a topic of "SS bad, dur!" as you suggest. It is also about the ability of the candidate to accurately assess SS, and convey meaning about it. Plus it's fun calling things by derogatory labels like "ponzi scheme", "moron", and "conversation Nazi".

[DaShi]

And "SS."

[Aeson]

Damn you! Damn you to hell for pointing out my stealth Godwinization!

[Felch]

Okay, so how would they means-test the benefits? Would they reduce the payments you receive if you have more than a certain amount of wealth?

Yeah, exactly. Social Security should alleviate poverty among the elderly, not buy AARP votes.

[Uncle Sparky]

—- Michael Tanner is a senior fellow at the Cato Institute and author of Leviathan on the Right: How Big-Government Conservatism Brought Down the Republican Revolution.
[/q]

Inspector Clouseau's assistant Cato has his own institute? And this British actor is secretly behind the current American rightwing policies? Now it all makes sense.

[Dinner]

CATO is one of the first right wing astroturf groups founded by the Koch brothers. Like all Koch brothers' astroturf groups it's job is to lie and spin in the popular media in order to shift public opinion towards supporting right wing policies which benefit mainly just the super rich, people like the Koch brothers. I can understand why the Kochs want public policy designed to enrich themselves but I will never understand how the dirt poor dumbasses in the trailer parks agree to back policies which are against their personal self interest.

[giblets]

I don't know, the people pushing dumb policies aren't the ones calling them "dumbasses".

[Kidlicious]

How the hell is social security a Ponzi scheme...not seeing it. Really, your American right-wing rhetoric is pretty crap.

Well with a ponzi scheme you pay people who paid in before in the hope that others will join in so that you get paid but you don't get paid. Likewise someone eventually will get similarly burned with SS.

[Dinner]

I did that to get past the filter. Much like using ****e instead of ****.

[KrazyHorse]

Okay, so how would they means-test the benefits? Would they reduce the payments you receive if you have more than a certain amount of wealth?

Why should they do that? Much more reasonable would be to reduce benefits if you have more than a certain amount of lifetime earnings.