Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Warren Buffet speaks common sense; alarms most Republicans

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by snoopy369 View Post
    KH, the argument against double taxation is often a fairness argument (it's not fair the government taxes me twice!!) As reasonable economic argument are made I'd be happy to discuss those on said terms
    Ultimately corporate and capital gains taxes are incredibly difficult to actually do in a way that is both economically efficient, 'fair', and generate adequate revenue. I don't find it terribly surprising our government has failed to do so, given its own lack of efficiency...
    I'm a bit curious - how can two different taxations be considered double taxation ?
    With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

    Steven Weinberg

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Ben Kenobi View Post
      By what right? The powers of the state derive from the foundation of the state. The US does not have an established church, ergo they forgo taxation authority over the Church. The Church has been here a very long time.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by BlackCat View Post
        I'm a bit curious - how can two different taxations be considered double taxation ?

        All the profit of the corporation is owed to the shareholders.

        It gets taxed once as corporate income. Any cash the corporation then pays to shareholders gets taxed a second time as personal income.

        That is what they mean by taxed twice.

        I think you want to argue that this is fine, because you feel the company should be taxed at 50% in the first place. That's another thing.
        (\__/)
        (='.'=)
        (")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.

        Comment


        • Right. Essentially the argument of the 'double taxation' crowd is that if you own a company (say, you are the sole owner of a factory), and your company makes $10MM, and you simply take the profit entirely as income, it is first taxed as corporate income, and then when you take the remaining $8MM or whatever as income, you are taxed a second time. I don't really have a problem with that, from a fairness standpoint, as the way our laws protect corporations as effectively people.

          From an economic point of view it's a bit complicated. How do you tax appropriately (fairly and adequately to provide revenue) while encouraging investment and productive activities? Nobody's really come up with a good answer that covers all the bases yet...
          <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
          I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by DanS View Post
            This is tedious. Wouldn't you admit that if the taxes went down on the corporate tax, the income of the investor would go up, all else equal?
            KH successfully argued that if the corporate tax was raised that the cost would be passed on to the consumers/etc.

            Why would this not be the case here? Why is this a tax that Buffet feels and not the consumers?

            JM
            Jon Miller-
            I AM.CANADIAN
            GENERATION 35: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment.

            Comment


            • It isn't as linear a relationship as all that. Corporate taxes are generally only on _profits_, so they don't have the nice neat relationship with prices (and supply) that a direct cost has (say, labor), or a fixed tax (property tax, etc.). There is some relationship, just not as direct. In general, for a business selling good(s) with fairly elastic demand, much of the cost of the tax is going to come out of profits and not cause a price increase, because the P-Q curve still has the same intersection point, and assuming some profits exist (otherwise there would be no (corporate income) tax!) that is still generally the optimal point, excepting the risk adjustment (as your potential profit is lower, you will convert that to a lowered expected profit, and thus when comparing risk of loss versus profit, that comparison is a bit more on the loss side - though as long as you can offset future taxes with loss, that may cancel out to some extent). This is less true of the demand for the goods are price inelastic, as then the various businesses selling those goods can simply all raise their prices.

              This also depends heavily on various factors such as the aforementioned price elasticity of demand versus supply (as PE(D) > PE(S), the tax comes more out of profits), the potential for the business to relocate [either to avoid the tax, in which case the tax simply drives businesses away; or to a lower rent area, as willingness to pay rent is relative to profits, in which case the property owner will bear the brunt of the tax], and a host of other issues. It is definitely not, however, simply passed on to the consumer by definition (whether you are talking about raising or lowering taxes).
              <Reverend> IRC is just multiplayer notepad.
              I like your SNOOPY POSTER! - While you Wait quote.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by DanS View Post
                To be fair, Buffett's argument is then content-free as well.
                Buffett's argument is designed to appeal to less-intelligent people.

                What I assume he is actually hoping for is for people less wealthy than him, whose finances are extensive but not (essentially) infinite, to cut back their purchases of luxury goods if they're taxed more. It's just easier to appeal to a broad audience by saying "I have a lot of money; tax me."
                "You're the biggest user of hindsight that I've ever known. Your favorite team, in any sport, is the one that just won. If you were a woman, you'd likely be a slut." - Slowwhand, to Imran

                Eschewing silly games since December 4, 2005

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Jaguar View Post
                  Buffett's argument is designed to appeal to less-intelligent people.


                  Maybe he's targeting people intelligent enough to differentiate between knowledge and intelligence? Maybe he has a different opinion than you and his may be more valid than yours? Maybe the field you're in is a pseudo-science with no real correct answer?

                  Maybe you're not as intelligent as you think if you cannot see this. Maybe an intelligent person would be less pretentious and more receptive to the opinion of someone who is far more successful than you will ever be.
                  "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                  Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                  Comment


                  • Asher:

                    You're the one advocating forced asset seizure from the Church. Go ahead with that btw, see how far you get.
                    Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                    "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                    2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                    Comment


                    • Maybe an intelligent person would be less pretentious and more receptive to the opinion of someone who is far more successful than you will ever be
                      Sig material.
                      Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                      "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                      2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Ben Kenobi View Post
                        Asher:

                        You're the one advocating forced asset seizure from the Church. Go ahead with that btw, see how far you get.
                        I'm just for equality. If I pay taxes, why shouldn't pedophiles also pay taxes?
                        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                        Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                        Comment


                        • why shouldn't pedophiles also pay taxes?
                          Because they were there before this whole US of A things got going.
                          Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                          "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                          2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Ben Kenobi View Post
                            Because they were there before this whole US of A things got going.
                            So were atheists.
                            "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                            Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                            Comment


                            • There's an atheist church?

                              I guess the axiom is true. There's a difference between having money and understanding it.

                              I think it's hilarious that you are telling people to be less pretentious when you openly ascribe your personal value to the wealth you've accrued. What's next, spats?

                              Frankly, I think it's sad. You're telling a young and up and coming relatively bright person that he's never going to surpass you, that I find hilarious. As if that were difficult.

                              Asher, here's a protip. Those who've got it don't talk about it. Those who don't make a big deal out of it. Guess which side you fall in on.
                              Scouse Git (2) La Fayette Adam Smith Solomwi and Loinburger will not be forgotten.
                              "Remember the night we broke the windows in this old house? This is what I wished for..."
                              2015 APOLYTON FANTASY FOOTBALL CHAMPION!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Ben Kenobi View Post
                                Sig material.
                                And why is that exactly?

                                Do you think Jag will be more successful than Buffett?
                                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X