US Gun Laws

[The Mad Monk]

If there is an intruder in the house when you're home, it's already escalated. They are either desperate, or they are looking for an opportunity to do someone some damage. Either way, chances are good that things will go bad no matter how conciliatory you are.

I would rather not take that chance.

[Elok]

Would you be as scared if you knew the chance of the intruder having a gun was virtually nil?

If that was true, all you'd need is a bat or knife to scare him off -- not a gun.

You don't scare a burglar off with a gun, you hold a firefight in your living room, doing somersaults to get behind furniture and giving hand signals to your pets so they can recon. Generally speaking, that is; I understand there's a little-known rule that if either side pulls off that shooting-while-cartwheeling stunt from the lobby shootout scene in the original Matrix, the other side has to surrender.

[The Mad Monk]

You pray that you scare a burglar off with a gun, or hold him until police arrives.

If that doesn't work, you remove a burglar with your gun.

Alternatively, you don't go out to confront, and instead pick a sercure spot and call the police, gun at the ready.

Then you see who gets to you first.

[Asher]

If there is an intruder in the house when you're home, it's already escalated.

I don't think this is true at all. A burglar is a far cry from a murderer, but a burglar can become a murderer very quickly if his own life is threatened.

The vast majority of burglars aren't looking to kill anyone. But if your adrenalin is pumping and a redneck points a shotgun or handgun at your face, how would you respond?

Guns tend to escalate, not equalize.

[The Mad Monk]

Burglar may be a misnomer. Someone who breaks into your home, knowing someone is there, is looking for trouble.

[Asher]

Burglar may be a misnomer. Someone who breaks into your home, knowing someone is there, is looking for trouble.

Those are called home invasions, and are incredibly rare. At least up here...

And they're almost always targeted.

[The Mad Monk]

Home Invasion. Yeah, that's it.

PRINT THIS ARTICLE The search continues Monday night for suspects wanted in connection with a home invasion robbery in Zanesville.

Zanesville Police say it happened last Friday evening at 17 Ceramic Avenue. Detective Sgt. Ric Roush says the residents of the home, which consisted of four adults and one juvenile, reported that four males entered the home all dressed in black, wearing ski masks, hoodies, and gloves demanding money, one of the suspects was armed with a hand gun.

"During the home invasion robbery, one of the male victims did suffer a gun shot wound to his left leg. He is still currently in a hospital in Columbus recovering from his wounds; non-life threatening wounds," said Detective Sgt. Ric Roush.

Detective Roush says after receiving the undisclosed amount of money, the four suspects fled from the home after stealing a Mercedes which belonged to the residents.

"Now since this occured Friday night, last night, Sunday evening, we did recover the vehicle that was taken after it was set on fire here in the 900 block of Adair Avenue," said Detective Roush.

Detective Roush says they arrested a 33-year-old male from Zanesville in connection to the car fire but will not release his name until he is formally charged. The suspect is being questioned as to his possible involvement in the home invasion robbery.

http://www.whiznews.com/content/news/local/2011/01/17/search-for-suspects-in-home-invasion-robbery

Home invasion in Lowell
Updated: Tuesday, 18 Jan 2011, 9:11 AM EST
Published : Tuesday, 18 Jan 2011, 8:20 AM EST

(Fox 25/ My Fox Boston) - This morning, police are investigating a home invasion on East Merrimack St in Lowell, MA.

According to the 'Lowell Sun,’ a woman was home alone with her 4-month old child when three men forced their way into her apartment, tied her up and hit her.

The woman's husband had gone for a short walk but reportedly fought off the attackers when he came home.

Police are looking for three men, one of whom had a knife.

http://www.myfoxboston.com/dpp/news/crime_files/home-invasion-in-lowell-20110118

Lexington Police are looking for the three people responsible for robbing and tying up a woman inside her own home.

It happened late Monday night when the 66-year-old woman says a woman knocked on the door of her Shawnee Avenue home, off Bryan Avenue.

When the homeowner opened it, she says two strange men forced their way inside and forced to her to the rear of the home.

The robbers tied up the woman with a robe or some type of clothing, while they ransacked the house.

The robbers got away with cash, jewelry, credit cards and some Walmart gift cards.

Police hope to track some of those items to see if they can find the robbers.

It took the woman about 30 minutes to free herself before she could call police.

The woman was treated for a cut to her cheek.

Police are investigating whether this call could be connected to a call of some suspicious people seen about a block away around the same time the crime happened.

http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/Woman_tied_up_robbed_in_home_invasion_114110634.ht ml

PLENTY more behind the top link.

[Asher]

Doesn't matter if you cite a few, statistically they're incredibly rare and they're almost always targeted. In Canada, it's virtually 100% gang-related every time.

[The Mad Monk]

That's where the "plenty more behind the link" comes in. It's a news search.

[Asher]

That's where the "plenty more behind the link" comes in. It's a news search.

Yes, and it'll show dozens of instances out of hundreds of millions of homes...

[The Mad Monk]

So what level of risk do you think I should be willing to accept?

[Felch]

Guns are never an equalizing force. They are simply escalating forces.

Damnit Asher, this is the dumbest thing I've ever heard you say.

Guns are equalizers. A hundred and ten pound woman with a baseball bat is not much of a threat to a two hundred pound man with a baseball bat. However, that same woman with a gun can go toe to toe with that man, even if he also has a gun. Firearms change everything by using chemistry to trump physical fitness. Guns made western civilization possible by ending the tyranny of rural professional warrior classes, and putting power into the hands of urban wealth creators.

You're absolutely foolish to believe that a home invader will treat you with respect just because you're defenseless. Violent *******s respect power and violence.

As an aside, I don't think that the solution to police violence is to arm up with pistols. Police body armor is generally IIIa or worse, which is meant to stop pistols and shot. I put most of my firearms spending into rifles, specifically the 5.56 and the 30-06.

[Asher]

Canadian stats:

There were 2,700 home invasions in Canada in 2008 out of 6,708,259 homes -- a rate of 0.0004% per year.

43% of them involved a weapon (knife, bat, gun, etc), so the chance per year of a home invasion with a weapon of any kind is 0.000172%.

14% of them involved a firearm, which is a 0.000056% chance per year.

You're seriously using this as justification for arming everyone with guns?

[Asher]

Damnit Asher, this is the dumbest thing I've ever heard you say.

Guns are equalizers. A hundred and ten pound woman with a baseball bat is not much of a threat to a two hundred pound man with a baseball bat. However, that same woman with a gun can go toe to toe with that man, even if he also has a gun.

You think an elderly lady with a handgun is on equal footing as a 25 year old gangbanger who has probably used his gun many, many times?

They're not equal. And in all likelihood, the kid wouldn't kill the woman unless she threatened his life. The only way she can do that is with a gun.

Escalating.

If you're mugged on the street by a guy with a gun, the thing to do is just hand over your wallet. You certainly do not try to pull out your own concealed handgun and shoot him. A gun in that case only escalates.

[Arrian]

It's an equalizer if the attacker doesn't have a gun. Or if you know how to use your gun and they don't. Or if your skills are, well, equal. It's only not an equalizer if you don't know what you're doing and they do.

Come on, Asher. I loathe the gun culture in this country, but you're getting close to arguing up is down here.

edit: a gun can be both an equalizer *and* an escalator, no?

-Arrian