Christianity ruins families.

[Robert]

I think we more or less agree.
BTW both Jesus and Peter told their followers to stop it when people did not want to listen. Jesus said that you should remove the dust from your feet and move on, Peter said that no christian should be hated because he's getting involved with other's affairs all the time.

Unfortunately christians are oftenly hated because of doing exactly that

Of course the purpose of an off topic forum is to discuss differences in opinions. People who come here should not whine about people expressing their believes/opinions over and over again.

[rah]

As long as they recognize that it's just an opinion. I have a problem when people state something as fact when it can't be proved.

[Ming]

Of course the purpose of an off topic forum is to discuss differences in opinions. People who come here should not whine about people expressing their believes/opinions over and over again.

But when it is hate speech and bigotry...

I have no problem if people want to believe in Jesus, Thor, Budda, A single holy god with many names, Aliens, Moses, Odin, Zeus, Santa, the Tooth Fairy or whatever... but when those beliefs lead to infringing on the rights of others, they can cram it! Just because some religion thinks they are above the law, doesn't make it so. They are subject to the same laws of the land as everybody else... no matter what myth they believe in.

[Robert]

@rah: people have the right to believe that their faith is a fact. You have the right to believe that your thumb is factually the center of the universe.
And if people speak out stupid things, others will laugh at them.

@Ming: if it's hate speech then it's not allowed.

[Ming]

@Ming: if it's hate speech then it's not allowed.

Then maybe you should reread a lot of posts

[Nikolai]

FWIW, I agree with Plomp and Ming & co here.

[rah]

@rah: people have the right to belief that their faith is a fact. You have the right to believe that your thumb is factually the center of the universe.
And if people speak out stupid things, others will laugh at them.

You can believe whatever you want if you keep it to yourself. But when you use that believe to infringe on other's rights, then I have a problem. And yes we laugh at Ben all the time.

[Flubber]

You can believe whatever you want if you keep it to yourself. But when you use that believe to infringe on other's rights, then I have a problem. And yes we laugh at Ben all the time.

But that is a special case. I laugh at Ben all the time in threads about hockey or bicycles. So that is unrelated to faith

[Ming]

But that is a special case. I laugh at Ben all the time in threads about hockey or bicycles. So that is unrelated to faith

Ture enough... it is easy enough to laugh at every post he makes... because he thinks he knows everything, yet his lack of knowledge on so many topics is amazing

[Robert]

You can believe whatever you want if you keep it to yourself. But when you use that believe to infringe on other's rights, then I have a problem.

In a democracy everybody is allowed to voice his/her opinion, and allowed to attempt to get his ideas into laws. As long as people respect the laws that are established.

I'm glad that the past advocators of freedom for colored people, emancipation of women, etc. did not shut up. It's hard to draw a line that seperates those who support 'bad' new ideas from those who support 'good' new ideas. Every now established democratic idea once was considered to be evil by the majority.

And we limit each other's rights all the time. If we wouldn't, we would be able to have a society.
I think people make themselves look stupid if they continue try to push their truth through other's throats. They'll lose sympathy for their ideas anyway, and are counterproductive to their goals.

But neither should people voice that others aren't supposed to speak out their opinion. The first makes someone look stupid, the latter is a treath to democracy.

Ming: Then maybe you should reread a lot of posts

Send me the links

[rah]

In a democracy everybody is allowed to voice his/her opinion, and allowed to attempt to get his ideas into laws. As long as people respect the laws that are established.

The operative phrase is "respect the laws that are established"
Some here think their beliefs are above the law. Those are the ones I have a problem with. If you don't like the laws, put your energy into changing them, not breaking them.

[Kidlicious]

So you believe in your Myths, and they believe in theirs... What makes your myth any better than theirs? They probably think your myth is not as good as theirs. And none of you have any proof either way. It all comes down to faith.

So how do you prove your faith is stronger than theirs? Faith is Faith. And who are you to claim that you faith is stonger than theirs when you don't even understand their faith.

There are tons of different religions out their, what makes yours so special?
And if you only answer is a unproveable myth, they all have them too.

As Plomp said, I agree that the Bible is the best scripture of any religion.

That brings up another point. Christianity isn't as much a religion as a it is a way to have a relationship with God. And it's that way that makes Christianity better.

Finally, Christianity is the most persecuted of any religion. Persecution is the only way that it can be held in check. If not held in check it will spread throughout the globe very quickly. Take China for example. The Chinese people are very hungry for Christianity, but the Chinese govtment does what it can to keep it from spreading.

[Kidlicious]

The Bible is terrible literature. The characters are poorly developed with outlandish origin stories and the plot is filled with holes and lacks continuity. Then there are the Psalms tacked on. Worse than Bumblebutt's LotR songs.

Of course, if you base you beliefs on crap literature, you aren't but a few steps from Scientology.

You haven't read the Bible.

[Kidlicious]

So what was "generally" about? How is that not subjective?

I explained that clearly. Are you stoned or something. The belief that Jesus Christ is subjective. The belief in everything the Bible says is subjected to. Why? Because I believe that the Bible is the word of God.

At least I let the science lead me to my belief system, if a conflict arises the science wins over existing beliefs.

Where did you get the idea that I oppose science?

Thats more objective than your "absolute truth",

I was not aware that the assertion that there is no such thing as absolute truth was a scientific fact.

and I'd like for you to show me where in Genesis it says God created the waters and the universe. Heaven and Earth are not what you think... We aint even talking about the same "God".

I have no idea what you are on about. It's very clear to anyone who reads teh Bible that God created everything.

Agreeing with a bunch of stuff Jesus said doesn't mean you gotta buy into everything in the book...

If you belief that God is Allmighty as Jesus said, then it does mean the you have to believe everything God says.

If God created the universe, the blueprint gives us insights into the Creator. We're just reading different books, but mine can be edited.

What is the blueprint? Look don't you think that if God wanted us to know him by studying the universe that it would be a lot easier and more revealing? What do you think the meaning of life is? Do you believe that it is coming to know God? If it is wouldn't God provide us a way to know him intimately?

But that was the plan, right? Jesus had to die for our sins, true? How do you remove God from his own plan? God showed his love by having us kill his son, and you're here chastising me for subjectivity. Sorry, the creator (if there is 1) of the universe aint down here engaging in human sacrifice in the name of love.

Much less having people executed for gathering firewood on the Sabbath!

Jesus Christ is not dead. He and the Father are one. The Christ sits at the right hand of God. Christ was there in the beginning and he will be there always.

[Kidlicious]

Thanks for actually agreeing with my point. Even you realize it's JUST a personal belief. You have done a great job describing why it's a good personal belief for you. OUTSTANDING. But other people have reasons for believing what they believe, and their reasons are probably as good if not better than yours.

Most people who have different spiritual beliefs fall into 2 categories. The first is the person who believes what his or her parents taught him or that society expects them to believe. The second is the person who just believes what is convenient for their current lifestyle. Christianity is the only belief system system that converts people the way it does and that is actually a faith. I say that because people who just believe in what is convenient to them really don't have faith.