I bring you...the awesomeness

[Guynemer]

Hmmm. Wasn't aware of that.

Well, no one's perfect.

[Hauldren Collider]

Why don't you guys just set Ben to ignore? You hate everything that he says.

[Asher]

There is no way in which he sucks.

Dude, he can't imagine a way to spend a million dollars. I refuse to believe someone that lacking in creativity can not suck.

Two words: blow & hos

[Asher]

Why don't you guys just set Ben to ignore? You hate everything that he says.

Self-esteem booster

[Drake Tungsten]

Two words: blow & hoes

Those are definitely two of my top-five options.

Why don't you guys just set Ben to ignore?

I have. It's an exclusive club.

[Hauldren Collider]

Self-esteem booster

I dunno about you, but knowing I am better than Ben doesn't boost my self esteem by a lot.

[Ben Kenobi]

Dude, he can't imagine a way to spend a million dollars. I refuse to believe someone that lacking in creativity can not suck.

There's a difference in lacking creativity and choosing something else altogether. I really don't care what a million dollars can buy me. I do care about what I ought to do with a million dollars.

[Hauldren Collider]

He wasn't talking about you, he was talking about Elok, dumbass.

[Drake Tungsten]

For Guy's edification...

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?p=5764986#post5764986

[Guynemer]

Why don't you guys just set Ben to ignore? You hate everything that he says.

As I said, no one is perfect.

Apparently, I'm the only one smart enough to have him on ignore. Which, I guess, makes me perfect.

[Ben Kenobi]

Sorry, I've been away at the midnight Paschal service, as Satanists who hate Jesus are wont to do.

So why drop a turd on us before you head off? That I don't understand. I personally don't appreciate what you did here.

Ben, I don't hate Jesus. I don't particularly dislike the Catholic church per se. But I despise stupidity, obfuscation and obscurantism.

Well of course you do. Elok, I don't think you serve Satan, that was Asher's comment, not mine. My comment is that there are many masters.

Yes, you despise those three, because you worship knowledge above all else. You consider knowledge in and of itself to be the top goal. Not God. This is a problem.

I think employing lies, hysterical and blatantly false comparisons and stonewalling to ostensibly serve the Prince of Peace is thoroughly revolting. And I think the church is the body of all believers, not just a collection of hierarchs.

So then why are you dropping a turd on your fellow brothers and sisters if you sincerely believe this to be true? I personally think you don't consider us Christians, or at the very least, not your brothers and sisters.

If His Beatitude the Ecumenical Patriarch, Bartholomew I, were accused of enabling pederasty, I would be demanding a thorough investigation of the matter.

As would I. But here's the difference. If he were proven to be guilty, I would not be happy. I would not be glad. I would be disappointed. I certainly wouldn't be posting a thread criticizing the patriarch. I'd probably be out there defending him too. It is right to criticise him for his actions, but to attack the Orthodox church in general is something very different.

This kind of perversion is doubly bad because in addition to harming children, which is quite bad enough, it harms the church and drives people away from God. It would be quite clear to me that the Patriarch, nominally a servant of Christ, had betrayed his trust, now valued his office and reputation above the faithful execution of his duties and the service of his Lord, and very possibly merited dismissal.

What if someone put those words in his mouth, or twisted his words to mean something else? What would you say then? Would you take what was said about him at face value or would you attempt to find out for yourself what is the truth?

It seems to me that you think differently, that men are immune to laws and even morals provided they wear sufficiently big hats. That's your problem.

No, my first question, is what ought to be the basis of Law. My answer is God. I'm not sure what your answer to this question would be. I trust the ecclesiastical authorities more than I do the secular authorities.

I don't believe that the pope or any priest is immune to God, but I do believe that the secular government also does not care what it is that God does or does not want. It's irrelevant to them. Therefore, if the source of Law comes from God, I do not expect in the secular realm to find justice.

[Drake Tungsten]

Apparently, I'm the only one smart enough to have him on ignore. Which, I guess, makes me perfect.

You've just shown your reading skills to be positively Slowwian.

[Cort Haus]

Elok

[Elok]

So why drop a turd on us before you head off? That I don't understand. I personally don't appreciate what you did here.

Well, it was this silly fellow's decision to use his Good Friday homily as an excuse for...whatever the deuce this was. And this isn't even an attack on the RCC, the guy was not speaking in an official capacity. This is just one man saying something cosmically dumb. If, oh, some OC priest had said that supporting the Turkish government in its battles with the Patriarchate means you supported the Armenian genocide (best equivalent I can think of), I wouldn't mind at all if you laughed at him. You just have this circle-the-wagons mentality.

Well of course you do. Elok, I don't think you serve Satan, that was Asher's comment, not mine. My comment is that there are many masters.

Yes, you despise those three, because you worship knowledge above all else. You consider knowledge in and of itself to be the top goal. Not God. This is a problem.

? Well, that's your opinion. I think wisdom is a gift of God, and the attitude of "don't think too hard, that's Satan talking" is a sign of weak faith. If you believe in God, you will trust Him to stand up to any sensible and fair inquiry. Sensible and fair being the key words there, which I realize are open to debate. But a mindset of suspicion, fear and kneejerk defensiveness are unbecoming of a Christian.

So then why are you dropping a turd on your fellow brothers and sisters if you sincerely believe this to be true? I personally think you don't consider us Christians, or at the very least, not your brothers and sisters.

Who's this 'us?' Perverted priests, enabling hierarchs, or one nutter with a pulpit and no sense of proportion? My aunt and godmother is a Catholic. I disagree with many of their theological stands, but I believe it is ultimately up to Christ to say who is or is not a Christian.

As would I. But here's the difference. If he were proven to be guilty, I would not be happy. I would not be glad. I would be disappointed. I certainly wouldn't be posting a thread criticizing the patriarch. I'd probably be out there defending him too. It is right to criticise him for his actions, but to attack the Orthodox church in general is something very different.

I'm not sure why you think I'd be glad, except to see the honor of the Church restored. And if you'd be defending a guilty man...why? Do you have a Christian duty to excuse wickedness on the part of authority figures?

What if someone put those words in his mouth, or twisted his words to mean something else? What would you say then? Would you take what was said about him at face value or would you attempt to find out for yourself what is the truth?

I admit I haven't been following all that closely what happened, but are you honestly saying that child-molesting priests were not shuffled around like a dirty-old-man version of the shell game, but promptly reported to the authorities for their crimes?

No, my first question, is what ought to be the basis of Law. My answer is God. I'm not sure what your answer to this question would be. I trust the ecclesiastical authorities more than I do the secular authorities.

I don't believe that the pope or any priest is immune to God, but I do believe that the secular government also does not care what it is that God does or does not want. It's irrelevant to them. Therefore, if the source of Law comes from God, I do not expect in the secular realm to find justice.

I believe theocracy is six different kinds of a bad idea, so separation--true separation--of church and state is ideal. It is the function of the state, not the church, to punish the breakers of the law, and the church has no right to obstruct the state's mission provided the state is acting within proper bounds. Which, in this case, it apparently is.

[Guynemer]

You've just shown your reading skills to be positively Slowwian.

No, simply my propensity for replying to a post before reading subsequent posts. Again.