A "what if" thread - Pearl harbor goes japanese

[Felch]

roosevelt should've invaded sweden in ww2

Smartest thing you've ever said.

Their Saabs and Ikea furniture are no match for our A-bombs.

[BeBMan]

Didn't read the threadi, it's tradition.

As for the question, I don't see Japan winning, even with Pearl Harbour. Overall it would have just taken maybe a bit longer.

[DanS]

If Japan would have won Midway, it would have been a lot tougher for the US.

That would have been a much better "what if" scenario. With Hawaii, they took out our battleships, but with Midway they could have taken out our carriers.

[Riesstiu IV]

It doesn't matter who the enemy is because America will always win.

[Dauphin]

Or, what if there was no Pearl Harbor attack.

[BlackCat]

Didn't read the threadi, it's tradition.

That is the proper way reading saturday night drunki arguing about nothing threads

[Drake Tungsten]

iraq under hussein was opposed to islamist regimes like the ones in iran and taleban in afganistan...

Wrong in your first sentence; I'd expect nothing less from you.

[RGBVideo]

ignorance is strength

congrats champ! your party and it's loyal puppies (incl. you, apparently) have permanently allied themselves with an anti-reality worldview! how does it feel?

what "side" hussein was matters preciously little by this point since hussein is history, what matters is what you guys do with iraq now. i expect US taxpayers (incl. you) to still pay for iraqi welfare and the occupation of the country with it's forces still in 2015 if demonizing reality continues the way you're doing it now

[Drake Tungsten]

Why don't you show me some evidence of Hussein's opposition to the Taliban before you try condescending to me while changing the subject?

Moron...

[Dinner]

He was anti-Islamist for most of his political career. Mainly because he saw Islamism as a threat to him so he spent decades surpressing it and pumping up secularism though after his defeat in the first gulf war he added a few superficial trappings of Islamism (like adding Islamic scribbles to the Iraqi flag) in an attempt to boost nationalism.

BTW the Iraqi government did not willingly allow people to travel to Afghanistan to fight to Soviets in the 1980's largely because they had their own war and wanted to conserve manpower but also because Saddam didn't want people in his country trained in asymmetrical warfare which might be used against him. He was not a supporter of the Taliban.

[Drake Tungsten]

He was not a supporter of the Taliban.

He wasn't an opponent of the Taliban, either.

[Patroklos]

The only reason why the first attack was successful was because the US was caught by surprise. I doubt a second attack would have done much damage. Hawaii was at the outer edges of where the Japanese could project power, IIRC. And after Midway, they couldn't project any power to Hawaii.

Unfortunetly for the Americans, after the initial attacks alerted of not they had no means to resist further. More Japanese attacks would have yeilded the destuction of things like the fuel dumps and submarines which in the actual timeline caused great pains for the Japanese.

More importantly, they should have stuck around and and tried to destroy US carriers then and there. Delaying the carrier battle just gave the US time to regroup. The carriers were out on a training mission without proper escort and totally unprepared for war, if they could have been located they would have been easy pickings.

I am not sure why you think an invasion force comprising a few dozen vessels would have been easily discovered, including them with an attack force already comprising several dozen major warships really wouldn't have made the force any more detectable relative.

[Ben Kenobi]

Especially considering that the Japanese managed to only sink the Yorktown, which had been damaged at the Coral Sea. They were very fortunate to have been able to repair the Yorktown in time for the battle, which managed to take 2 attacks.

[DanS]

Unfortunetly for the Americans, after the initial attacks alerted of not they had no means to resist further. More Japanese attacks would have yeilded the destuction of things like the fuel dumps and submarines which in the actual timeline caused great pains for the Japanese.

More importantly, they should have stuck around and and tried to destroy US carriers then and there. Delaying the carrier battle just gave the US time to regroup. The carriers were out on a training mission without proper escort and totally unprepared for war, if they could have been located they would have been easy pickings.

I am not sure why you think an invasion force comprising a few dozen vessels would have been easily discovered, including them with an attack force already comprising several dozen major warships really wouldn't have made the force any more detectable relative.

I assume that the US carriers could have run away. Also, I assume that a few dozen vessels wouldn't have been sufficient to take over Hawaii and garrison it.

[DanS]

Or, what if there was no Pearl Harbor attack.

Another good hypothetical.

The US would have become involved (more than it was already), but I wonder at what level of effort and at what time.