Parents Say Students Forced To Learn Spanish

[Caligastia]

Originally posted by Kidicious


I don't have anything against it per se, just trying to make your prefered language that common language.

It's the New-Age Hippie way.

[Blake]

Originally posted by Kidicious
I'm saying that we need to kick the jack asses who don't care out of school and make the parents more accountable. That will help free up resources to help the kids who are trying.

Believe it or not, children don't choose their parents.

Fact is, people who don't try, have been conditioned that way. Little kids tend to be very good at trying, and you can only conclude, that people who stop trying, have been conditioned that way. Unless they stop trying out of sheer force of will .

Generally speaking, children will be conditioned to not try by the following groups of people:
Family.
Teachers.
Friends.

Now, having some POSITIVE role models somewhere in there certainly acts as a good contrary force... but it's quite possible for some kids to not have any positive role models in family or friends...


I want to mention success and failure again.

A smart kid who erroneously concludes that success is a good thing and failure is bad, may use logic like this with regards to voluntary "special classes":
I can go into a harder class, but that means I will fail more often. I will get lower marks on tests. I will be less successful, and it's just more work...
Moving into a more difficult class; means less success, more failure, and more work.
That is not precisely appealing.

This means the kid either needs to have strong will / not fear failure. Or they need to have a parent or teacher with a cattle prod behind them, motivating them! If their parents, friends and teachers have all become consumed by apathy, they will most likely not be motivated. They will stay where success is easy and painless, rather than going to where success is hard and painful.

What I think; is that school should be significantly harder, but much less of a deal made over grades. A school should not really be about measuring at all, it should simply be for learning and growth.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Blake
Fact is, people who don't try, have been conditioned that way. Little kids tend to be very good at trying, and you can only conclude, that people who stop trying, have been conditioned that way. Unless they stop trying out of sheer force of will .

I assume that you don't have kids yet.

Kids don't want to try. They are't conditioned not to try. That's how they are born. You have to tell them that they have to do it. You have to condition them to do what you tell them to do. They are born to test you and to resist your control, and that means school.

I guess I'm wasting my breath here.

[OzzyKP]

No, Blake is.

I've never put someone on my ignore list, but if I did, it would be you, Kid. There isn't a more nonsensical poster here on Poly.

Snoopy, Arrian, etc all have good points, and you just seem confused all the time.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by OzzyKP
No, Blake is.

I've never put someone on my ignore list, but if I did, it would be you, Kid. There isn't a more nonsensical poster here on Poly.

Snoopy, Arrian, etc all have good points, and you just seem confused all the time.

And your Youth Rights Philosophy is tragic. I still listen to you and will continue without taking offense. Take it easy bud.

[Krill]

Blake, have you actually said what the actual aim of the kids success is supposed to be? Big suburban house with 2.4 kids and a wife, or living alone content with their own mind and trying to improve life for themselves? What is it the kid is supposed to do with his or her life?

[Krill]

A MODERN FABLE

Aesop's fables and other traditional children's stories involve allegory
far too subtle for the youth of today. Children need an updated message
with contemporary circumstance and plot line, and short enough to suit
today's minute attention span.

The Troubled Aardvark

Once upon a time, there was an aardvark whose only pleasure in life was
driving from his suburban bungalow to his job at a large brokerage house
in his brand new 4x4. He hated his manipulative boss, his conniving and
unethical co-workers, his greedy wife, and his snivelling, spoiled
children. One day, the aardvark reflected on the meaning of his life and
his career and on the unchecked, catastrophic decline of his nation, its
pathetic excuse for leadership, and the complete ineffectiveness of any
personal effort he could make to change the status quo. Overcome by a
wave of utter depression and self-doubt, he decided to take the only
course of action that would bring him greater comfort and happiness: he
drove to the mall and bought imported consumer electronics goods.

MORAL OF THE STORY: Invest in foreign consumer electronics manufacturers.
-- Tom Annau

From while you wait; kind of puts this arguement in perspective.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Krill

A MODERN FABLE

Aesop's fables and other traditional children's stories involve allegory
far too subtle for the youth of today. Children need an updated message
with contemporary circumstance and plot line, and short enough to suit
today's minute attention span.

The Troubled Aardvark

Once upon a time, there was an aardvark whose only pleasure in life was
driving from his suburban bungalow to his job at a large brokerage house
in his brand new 4x4. He hated his manipulative boss, his conniving and
unethical co-workers, his greedy wife, and his snivelling, spoiled
children. One day, the aardvark reflected on the meaning of his life and
his career and on the unchecked, catastrophic decline of his nation, its
pathetic excuse for leadership, and the complete ineffectiveness of any
personal effort he could make to change the status quo. Overcome by a
wave of utter depression and self-doubt, he decided to take the only
course of action that would bring him greater comfort and happiness: he
drove to the mall and bought imported consumer electronics goods.

MORAL OF THE STORY: Invest in foreign consumer electronics manufacturers.
-- Tom Annau

From while you wait; kind of puts this arguement in perspective.

Is that directed at me? I'm not particularly fond of electronics. I love my son, and he's a straight A student btw.

[Krill]

It wasn't directed at anyone.

[Kidlicious]

Ok, sorry.

[Ben Kenobi]

Offer more than $35,000 a year to be a teacher. If we want the brightest folks teaching our kids, we need to offer competitive salaries ($60,000+ for even moderately experienced folks), and probably encourage professionals to teach a class college-style (one three hour class a week or something like that) so that folks who would like to teach but don't want to only teach have an opportunity to make a difference...

What makes you think high school teachers WANT things to be 'just like college'.

No, frankly I wouldn't want it that way and pretty much every high school teacher I talk to HATES the college model. That's why they are teaching high school. I'd much rather teach 9-5 as in high school.

[Kuciwalker]

College >>>>>>>>> High School

[Krill]

College bar >> College >>>>>>>>>>>>>> HS

[Blake]

Originally posted by Krill
Blake, have you actually said what the actual aim of the kids success is supposed to be? Big suburban house with 2.4 kids and a wife, or living alone content with their own mind and trying to improve life for themselves? What is it the kid is supposed to do with his or her life?

Doesn't matter.

There's a difference between "success at school" at the micro, and at the macro level.

For example, someone who is innately brilliant can be a straight A student without putting in any effort at all.

Another kid, who is highly average, could work very hard and get straight A's.

Now, according to the measurements, both students are succeeding equally. Except obviously, the smart kid is not actually succeeding at growing nearly so much as the average student who has to work hard...

There is succeeding according to the measurements, and then there is succeeding at personal growth. Regardless of what quantifies personal growth, it can be very obvious what ISN'T personal growth...

[Ben Kenobi]

Actually I found HS >>>>>>>> College.

College sucked.