Evil Estonians Crack Down on Helpless Russian Minority

[Heresson]

Originally posted by Colon™
Russia shouldn't meddle in Estonia's internal affairs.

Teh Motherland can not tolerate a hostile nation right next to its second biggest city.

Next You're going to say Russia should not meddle in Finland's, Ukraine's or anyone else's affairs as well

[Jarouik]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Jarouik, I believe Estonians have been saying that the statue occupies a very prominent location in Tallinn, one which most people believe would be put to better use as a memorial to the people who were killed or imprisoned during the years of Soviet occupation. They're proposing moving the Soviet era war memorial to a less prominent location with in the city.

I agree, and I know that they are merely (respectfully) trying to move the statue to a military graveyard. Of course the Russian response is over the top - you have no argument there. I have absolutely no sympathy for the Russian statesmen exploiting the incident to gain popularity.

The point is that since the statue has become such a symbol for the Russian minority in Estonia, why anger them purposefully by moving it? The government knew it was going to cause trouble. It is as if the Estonian government wanted to show they are not interested in the opinions of their minorities - a European Union country should know better.

[Jarouik]

Also, if the government wants to build a statue to commemorate the victims of soviet oppression, what better place to build it than next to the "liberators" monument, and preferably taller than it That would tell both sides of the story.

[Lancer]

They join NATO yet?

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Jarouik
Also, if the government wants to build a statue to commemorate the victims of soviet oppression, what better place to build it than next to the "liberators" monument, and preferably taller than it That would tell both sides of the story.

Sculp the controversy!

[Jarouik]

Originally posted by Lancer
They join NATO yet?

Yep, they have been in NATO and EU a number of years...

[Lancer]

The offending statue, the coming statue, the police and the protesters, we are all star stuff... according to Carl Sagan.

[Lancer]

Originally posted by Jarouik


Yep, they have been in NATO and EU a number of years...

Well they can tell the Russians to take a hike, they have France and Germany on their side. The nation of Napoleon and Bismark!

Actually long ago I'd have tossed the uninvited Russians out.

Whatever happened top Saras?

[Jarouik]

Originally posted by Lancer


Well they can tell the Russians to take a hike, they have France and Germany on their side. The nation of Napoleon and Bismark!

Actually long ago I'd have tossed the uninvited Russians out.

Whatever happened top Saras?

So you really think that escalating the conflict is the most prudent thing to do? The world has enough wars as it is. There is also the matter of the half a million or so ethnic Russians in Estonia, who should have equal rights to other Estonians.

[Solver]

The point is that since the statue has become such a symbol for the Russian minority in Estonia, why anger them purposefully by moving it? The government knew it was going to cause trouble.

I highly doubt that many of the rioters who were involved in this looting and violence actually care about what the statue symbolizes or its historical meaning. Part of the ethnic Russian minority that lives in Estonia actually doesn't like the country and is loyal to Russia. The Russian government says that it doesn't like the idea of moving the statue. Therefore, these people protest over it - not because of some historical meaning, but because Russia doesn't want it to happen.

Unsurprisingly, most rioters also were young people...

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by Jarouik


So you really think that escalating the conflict is the most prudent thing to do? The world has enough wars as it is. There is also the matter of the half a million or so ethnic Russians in Estonia, who should have equal rights to other Estonians.

Escalating it to war status is of course stupid, but similary is suppressing debate about the subject.

[Wycoff]

I agree with the Estonians on this. The monuments to the USSR that dot Eastern Europe have always striken me as inappropriate. The USSR wasn't a liberator; it was a conqueror. The Red Army raped and pilliaged its way across Eastern Europe and ultimately imposed Communist totalitarianism for 60 years. That regime is no more deserving of memorialization than the 3rd Reich.

The next monument that should go is the Soviet war memorial at the Tiergarden in Berlin. Its original purpose was to reinforce to the Germans that they were conquered. That lesson has been well learned. Now it serves no other purpose than to bestow upon the Soviets an underserved sense of moral superiority. It's bizarre to see a statute dedicated glorifying the USSR two kilos away from the Berlin wall, which is the real monument to the glories of the Soviet system. If I were German, I'd want the Tiergarten soviet memorial replaced with a more appropriate memorial. I think we'd all be better off with a positive memorial dedicated to peace between Germany and Russia rather than the current monument glorifying a morally bankrupt system.

The Estonian decision is getting some support elsewhere in Eastern Europe. According to this article, a Polish political group wants to remove Soviet war memorials: http://en.rian.ru/world/20070428/64633570.html

[Heresson]

it's not a first soviet/communist monument that is being removed You know...

[Colon™]

Originally posted by Jarouik


So you really think that escalating the conflict is the most prudent thing to do? The world has enough wars as it is. There is also the matter of the half a million or so ethnic Russians in Estonia, who should have equal rights to other Estonians.

The Estonians indeed should be pressed to guarantee equal treatment to the Russian minority, but Russia should never the less be told to take a hike. It's embarrasing Merkel wants to "mediate" while Russia has no legitimate right to react in such a manner in the first place.

[Kassiopeia]

Originally posted by Lancer


Well they can tell the Russians to take a hike, they have France and Germany on their side. The nation of Napoleon and Bismark!

Those two countries don't exactly have a spotless record when it comes to land wars and Asia.

They should have moved the monument when all the statues of Lenin were toppled 15 years ago. Then it would have just gone with the flow.