Russia to temporarily withdraw from Treaty on Conventional Forces in Europe

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Nikolai
GDP is not everything. I prefer to live in a free country where I don't risk being dead if I am an annoyance to the government, whether a journalist or a businessman.

But in Russia, you can buy off someone in government to cover you pretty easy. It is much harder in free countries.

[Serb]

Originally posted by Saras
PPP is voodoo, Serb.

Oh really?

Perhaps you will admit for a once in a lifetime, that you were wrong here:

Originally posted by Saras
Their GDP is maybe 10% bigger than that of the Netherlands, I think.

???

This statement is far from true for nominal GDP as well.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by OzzyKP
If Russia is our friend and ally then why don't we invite them into NATO?

Friends and allies don't aid in the development of an enemy's nuclear program.

[Serb]

Originally posted by PLATO
Russia:

GDP (official exchange rate):
$733 billion (2006 est.)

Netherlands:

GDP (official exchange rate):
$612.7 billion (2006 est.)

List of countries by GDP (nominal)
2006 List by the International Monetary Fund:

Russia: 979,048
Netherlands: 663,119

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_%28nominal%29

As for 2007:

The country's GDP (PPP) soared to $1.5 trillion in 2004, making it the ninth largest economy in the world and the fifth largest in Europe. For the year of 2007, Russia's GDP is projected to grow to about $1.2 trillion nominally (31.2 trillion rubles) that would be about $2.3 trillion PPP and would make Russia the second largest economy in Europe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia

I know the CIA World Factbook is not as authoritative as Wikipedia.

Exactly.

[Nikolai]

If Russia came into NATO, our only enemy would be the Chinese. As soon as China implodes(as it always do at some point), NATO would go in, restore peace, and be so mighty that the world would unite under one banner. A united world means, as we all know, the coming of the Anti-Christ and the world's ultimate doom.

Conclusion: We do not want Russia into NATO.

[Serb]

Originally posted by Nikolai
GDP is not everything. I prefer to live in a free country...blah-blah-blah...propaganda crap...

Where do you perefer to live is irrelevant to the topic.

[Nikolai]

Originally posted by PLATO


But in Russia, you can buy off someone in government to cover you pretty easy. It is much harder in free countries.

Yeah. You do have a point there. If you excuse me, I'll go prepare my application for russian citizenship.

[Patroklos]

Nope, a pwnage of one of the Poly's leading economists Saras.

How many people live in Russia, how much territory do you have?

How many people live in The Netherlands, how much territory do they have?

The fact that you point out that Russia's GDP is only 3 times that of the Dutch, and say it proudly, is self pwnage.

[Nikolai]

Originally posted by Serb


Where do you perefer to live is irrelevant to the topic.

Not at all. It's no propaganda. It's a fact that Russia has one of the highest death rates for journalists in the world, that critics of the regime is silenced in one way or another, not neccessarily by death(fear is "good" too), but still, silenced.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by OzzyKP


I may be the only one, but I agree with your general sentiment Ecthy.

There is no reason for that missile shield. Al Qaeda is not going to launch missiles at Poland.

Please explain how you know Al Qaeda's plans. From everything they have published, they would most certainly fire a missle at anywhere in Europe the instant they acquired the ability.

However, with the proliferation of missle technology, the drive to develop nuclear weapons, and the fanatical politics of countries like Iran I believe that it is prudent to have a system that could answer their limited capability.

As for the oft repeated comment that "the cold war is over". For now it is. But if we continue to provoke Russia it may start up again. The Cold War didn't just happen because they were Commies and we weren't, it happened from a process of ratcheting up hostilities. They provoked us, we provoked them, back and forth.

Really? I thought the cold war was over things like the Soviets wanting to dominate Europe and telling the west "We will bury you!" , etc... The cold war did happen because they were communist and we weren't...and because the communist made no bones about "exporting the revolution"


[q]Everyone keeps saying "pssh, who cares, we can take them, let them keep whining." That is pretty much the same attitude our governments are taking and no wonder Russia is pissed off. No country likes to be pushed around, threatened, and humiliated internationally. If we want to stop the saber rattling, then we have to put down our sabers.[/b]

This is deluded. The Russian federation has cut off energy supplies, bullied neighbors, whinned about free countries associating with the west, and curtailed personal freedoms and moved to stiffle dissent. The west has proposed a missle defense system that would be tottally ineffective against Russian power and has, in fact, invited the Russians to participate in its development, deployment, and operation. The Russians are the saber rattlers here...not the west.

If Russia is our friend and ally then why don't we invite them into NATO?

Russia is invited to nearly every NATO conference. They will not ever be a member as long as they continue to threaten the west with "targeting Europe" and "Increasing conventional forces". They must first act like an allie before anyone will try to consider them one.

Russia nearly destroyed its economy by being an adversary of the west. When they decided to be friends then their economy has began to develop. It is ludicrous of them to try to start another arms race, but that seems to be the direction that they are moving.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Serb


Oh really?

Perhaps you will admit for a once in a lifetime, that you were wrong here:

Originally posted by Saras
Their GDP is maybe 10% bigger than that of the Netherlands, I think.

???

This statement is far from true for nominal GDP as well.

I never said that. Nor did I say:

it's about 1/3rd of the Russian GDP.

[Serb]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
Friends and allies don't aid in the development of an enemy's nuclear program.

And freind and ally do not suround its friend and ally with military bases.

[Serb]

Originally posted by PLATO


I never said that. Nor did I say:

it's about 1/3rd of the Russian GDP.

It's true for PPP.

List of countries by GDP (PPP) 2006:

Russia: 1,552,008 - 1,723,000
Netherlands: 512,000 - 541,513

[DinoDoc]

Spoils of the Cold War. You lost. Suck it up.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Serb


It's true for PPP.

Yes, but that truly is Voodoo and really irrelevant.