Do you have what it takes to become a citizen?

[snoopy369]

90%. The voting amendment (I don't remember names/titles well AT ALL) and the form. Though as Sloww says the name of the document made it obvious, I just misclicked. That's probably put in there as a gimme (as anyone applying for citizenship should have filled this out already and know the answer) ...

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by SlowwHand
So many are upset over the document.

The key is Petition vs. Request.
You personally are requesting to become a citizen.
Your family, friends, and members of the town didn't take up signatures on a petition requesting you be made a citizen.

That's the easiest way to explain it.

I thought that it would be a trick question. Since they used the word "request" in the question, I assumed that they were throwing a curve and that the answer would be the "petition" form. I didn't think that it would be that obvious.

Regardless, I think that it would be a fair question to ask an immigrant applying for citizenship, because they'd almost certainly know it. It's pretty useless trivia for us natural born citizens, though.


By the way, Sloww, just because something is a "petition" doesn't mean that it is a petition in the sense that you are using. People "petition" courts for things all the time; it simply means that they are requesting something. If you petition the court for relief at the end of a trial, you're not submitting a paper with 500 signitures requesting relief for you.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Originally posted by SlowwHand
So many are upset over the document.

The key is Petition vs. Request.
You personally are requesting to become a citizen.
Your family, friends, and members of the town didn't take up signatures on a petition requesting you be made a citizen.

That's the easiest way to explain it.

But "petition" is a synonym for "request," especially when it comes to asking for something from the government; hence the right to petition the government guaranteed in the 1st amendment. So common-sense language knowledge doesn't really help. (edit: x-post w/Wycoff)

The actual explanation is technical and bureaucratic (surprise!), not linguistic. In immigration law, petitions can only be filed by US citizens; a citizen or legal resident can file a petition requesting the immigration of a non-citizen family member, an employer can file a petition for a foreign worker, etc. But non-citizens never file petitions, only applications.

[senowen]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly

The actual explanation is technical and bureaucratic (surprise!), not linguistic. In immigration law, petitions can only be filed by US citizens; a citizen or legal resident can file a petition requesting the immigration of a non-citizen family member, an employer can file a petition for a foreign worker, etc. But non-citizens never file petitions, only applications.

Almost. A non-citizen or non-permanent resident can file what is called a "self-petition" for status if they were victims of abuse by a U.S. citizen or permanent resident. Moreover, illegal aliens can file a "Petition for Review" to a Federal Circuit Court of Appeals or a "Petition for Habeas Corpus" or a "Petition for Mandamus" to a Federal District Court for certain types of immigration relief. The fact that it is a "Petition" instead of a "Request" is a result of weird INS (now DHS) bureacratic BS if you ask me. Sorry if that explanation is not technical enough.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Originally posted by senowen


Almost. A non-citizen or non-permanent resident can file what is called a "self-petition" for status if they were victims of abuse by a U.S. citizen or permanent resident.

True. Snitches who help the Feds can also self-petition. But you take my broad point.

Moreover, illegal aliens can file a "Petition for Review" to a Federal Circuit Court of Appeals or a "Petition for Habeas Corpus" or a "Petition for Mandamus" to a Federal District Court for certain types of immigration relief. The fact that it is a "Petition" instead of a "Request" is a result of weird INS (now DHS) bureacratic BS if you ask me. Sorry if that explanation is not technical enough.

Petitions for review use "petition" in a judicial, not immigration, sense. But, yeah, that was my point: "petition" actually means something specific in INS/CIS jargon.

[senowen]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly

Petitions for review use "petition" in a judicial, not immigration, sense. But, yeah, that was my point: "petition" actually means something specific in INS/CIS jargon.

We are on the same page. Bureaucrats like categories and arbitrary rules and read Kafka as an instruction manual.

[Proteus_MST]

Originally posted by Wycoff
Regardless, I think that it would be a fair question to ask an immigrant applying for citizenship, because they'd almost certainly know it. It's pretty useless trivia for us natural born citizens, though.

Aren´t many of these questions rather useless trivia?

I mean, I understand that it is useful to know the Constitution and perhaps even to know who is in office today or how many judges there are in the supreme court,,
but of what use will it be for a new citizen of the United states to know which years are associated with certain events (like Declaration of Independence or writing of the consitution) or which states there were in the original US of A?

[Addled Platypus]

65 %

after some beers, and no sleep !!

write me in on the next election ballot