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The Star Wars vs Star Trek Thread; because it's been awhile.

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  • #226
    Originally posted by Boris Godunov
    How was it specific? He said ".5 past lightspeed"
    I prefer to follow the principle of parsimony when drawing conclusions from quote and not add self-serving assumptions.

    Assuming it is a simple linear multiplier is silly,

    You've yet to establish any meaningful reason why.

    [q]especially since the observed phenomenon in the films shows that hyperdrives operate at speeds vastly greater than the speed of light. [/QUOTE]
    We're discussing regular space drives. Of course hyperdrives go much faster than light speed.
    I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
    For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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    • #227
      You've yet to establish any meaningful reason why.
      yes he has. It has been shown that the SW space ships travel at vastly greater speeds than that of light. there for .5 past... obviously cannot mean only 50% faster, or however yall interpreted it.
      "I bet Ikarus eats his own spunk..."
      - BLACKENED from America's Army: Operations
      Kramerman - Creator and Author of The Epic Tale of Navalon in the Civ III Stories Forum

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      • #228
        Originally posted by Kramerman
        yes he has. It has been shown that the SW space ships travel at vastly greater speeds than that of light. there for .5 past...
        We're discussing regular space drives. Of course hyperdrives go much faster than light speed.
        I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
        For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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        • #229
          Star Wars is by far better solely because of episodes 1 and 2.


          YEAH RIGHT,
          but seriously Star Wars is much better than Star Trek. If the better were picked by their prequel, I'd still have to say Episode 1 and 2 are better than new Trek series, Enterprise. Anyways, here's my two cents...

          Everything about Star Wars is better, except for Jean Luc Picard; he is one cool captain. But nonetheless, the realm of Star Wars is much more fantastic. In a previous post, I recall someone declaring that SW has no depth, but clearly the numerous side-novels explain much of what is not in the movies. Also, the fact that the characters are always adventuring in SW beats the boring action of the Enterprise crew at their consoles. Likewise, all military units in SW are much cooler than their counterparts in ST.
          Liberty or death, what we so proudly hail. Once you provoke her, rattling of her tail.
          Never begins it, never, but once engaged. Never surrenders, showing the fangs of rage.
          -Metallica, 'Don't Tread On Me'

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          • #230
            Battle of Endor

            SIMPLY THE BEST FRIGGIN SPACE ACTION SEQUENCE IN THE HISTORY OF FILMMAKING. No wussy 1 on 1 battles or nuisance raids by pirates. This was a massive battle involving huge numbers of capital ships, fighters etc. IMO it is the single most awsome piece of action ever filmed.

            Add to this that there was a ground battle going on and a cool lightsaber duel (though I must admit that Empire and Episode I's lightsaber fights were better) and there you have it. The best 45 minutes of movie you will ever get to see.
            A true ally stabs you in the front.

            Secretary General of the U.N. & IV Emperor of the Glory of War PTWDG | VIII Consul of Apolyton PTW ISDG | GoWman in Stormia CIVDG | Lurker Troll Extraordinaire C3C ISDG Final | V Gran Huevote Team Latin Lover | Webmaster Master Zen Online | CivELO (3°)

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            • #231
              Originally posted by Ikarus
              but seriously Star Wars is much better than Star Trek. If the better were picked by their prequel, I'd still have to say Episode 1 and 2 are better than new Trek series, Enterprise. Anyways, here's my two cents...
              No way! Hoshi would never fall in love with a corrupt Jedi
              And also thanks God, Enterprise has got rid of the annoying kids that populated TNG and DS9, while Episode 1 is just about one annoying kid!
              "Never trust a man who puts your profit before his own profit." - Grand Nagus Zek, Star Trek Deep Space Nine, episode 11
              "A communist is someone who has read Marx and Lenin. An anticommunist is someone who has understood Marx and Lenin." - Ronald Reagan (1911-2004)

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              • #232
                Originally posted by Boris Godunov

                According to canonical sources (ANH novelization), the Empire alone controls 1 million star systems.
                That only turns the Empire into the evil big powerful enemy, like the B5 Shadows. the Borg or the Dominion. Either Sheridan, Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway or Archer would get rid of the Empire. not without a fight, but at the end they would win.

                By the way, anyone else consider B5 "unofficial" Star Trek?
                "Never trust a man who puts your profit before his own profit." - Grand Nagus Zek, Star Trek Deep Space Nine, episode 11
                "A communist is someone who has read Marx and Lenin. An anticommunist is someone who has understood Marx and Lenin." - Ronald Reagan (1911-2004)

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                • #233
                  Originally posted by DinoDoc

                  I prefer to follow the principle of parsimony when drawing conclusions from quote and not add self-serving assumptions.
                  The "self-serving" assumption is supported by an official source, which I cited, which you seem to be ignoring.

                  We're discussing regular space drives. Of course hyperdrives go much faster than light speed.
                  Well, we're actually discussing what the meaning ".5" was, whether it is referring to hyperdrive speed or sublight speed. The DFR quote supports it being a way of measuring hyperspace speed--not as a linear multiplier, but as a factor of some sort. That quote indicates .5 = 1.2million c. That is what the SW hyperdrives appear to function at.
                  Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                  • #234
                    Originally posted by OliverFA
                    That only turns the Empire into the evil big powerful enemy, like the B5 Shadows. the Borg or the Dominion. Either Sheridan, Kirk, Picard, Sisko, Janeway or Archer would get rid of the Empire. not without a fight, but at the end they would win.
                    Yeah, the "Good vs. Evil, so Good Must Win" line. Since the Federation has consistently behaved like a military junta and has even attempted genocide to win a war, I don't think Fed hands are so clean here.

                    Regardless, such notions are not part of typical SW vs. ST debates, as it relies on deus ex machina. If the strategic position of the Federation is so weak that they can only rely on "We have the good guys, so we'll win!" or "Q will come save us!," then the Feds have lost.

                    Looks like Earth will make a nice Imperial HQ for the Alpha Quadrant!
                    Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                    • #235
                      Go Ming for supporting the B5 crowd!

                      What do you want?
                      Exult in your existence, because that very process has blundered unwittingly on its own negation. Only a small, local negation, to be sure: only one species, and only a minority of that species; but there lies hope. [...] Stand tall, Bipedal Ape. The shark may outswim you, the cheetah outrun you, the swift outfly you, the capuchin outclimb you, the elephant outpower you, the redwood outlast you. But you have the biggest gifts of all: the gift of understanding the ruthlessly cruel process that gave us all existence [and the] gift of revulsion against its implications.
                      -Richard Dawkins

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                      • #236
                        How fitting that the first four letters of that show are "Baby." Fits the fan mentality perfectly.
                        Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                        • #237
                          Originally posted by Boris Godunov
                          Yeah, the "Good vs. Evil, so Good Must Win" line.
                          In fact what I was meaning is "the Federation is used to face much more poweful enemies and win them because of their superior intelect".

                          Since the Federation has consistently behaved like a military junta and has even attempted genocide to win a war, I don't think Fed hands are so clean here.
                          Er... Have you seen the same Star Trek as I have seen?
                          "Never trust a man who puts your profit before his own profit." - Grand Nagus Zek, Star Trek Deep Space Nine, episode 11
                          "A communist is someone who has read Marx and Lenin. An anticommunist is someone who has understood Marx and Lenin." - Ronald Reagan (1911-2004)

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                          • #238
                            When was the last time you heard about an election in the Federation?
                            Exult in your existence, because that very process has blundered unwittingly on its own negation. Only a small, local negation, to be sure: only one species, and only a minority of that species; but there lies hope. [...] Stand tall, Bipedal Ape. The shark may outswim you, the cheetah outrun you, the swift outfly you, the capuchin outclimb you, the elephant outpower you, the redwood outlast you. But you have the biggest gifts of all: the gift of understanding the ruthlessly cruel process that gave us all existence [and the] gift of revulsion against its implications.
                            -Richard Dawkins

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                            • #239
                              The Federation's facing of much more powerful enemies in the past must be balanced against comaring those enemies with the Empire. The Empire dwarfs even the Dominion in terms of scope, indutrial capacity, speed, technology and firepower. Remember that the SW Galaxy was united in a Republic 25,000 years prior to the Empire's existence. So the Empire has a technological advantage over the Federation of well over 25 millenia.

                              And yes I've seen the same ST. Let's talk about their genocidal plans, shall we? Infecting the Borg, infecting the Founders...gee, what a nice way to win a war! The Empire may be ruthless in conquest, but there's no instances of it using biological weapons to try to wipe out an entire species.

                              The Federation is, as far as I can tell, a junta wherein personal freedoms are at least as limited as they are under the Empire. So I don't think Federation colonists, once subjected to Imperial rule, would find there being much difference in their way of life.
                              Tutto nel mondo è burla

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                              • #240
                                Originally posted by Boris Godunov
                                gee, what a nice way to win a war! The Empire may be ruthless in conquest, but there's no instances of it using biological weapons to try to wipe out an entire species.
                                They just prefer to destroy entire planets.
                                I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
                                For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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