Apolyton Communist Party meeting: What is to be done?

[Lonestar]

Why? DuncanK, why do you (obviously, based on your sig) support the Marxist line of Communism? This is a man who had stated that *your* private Property should be taken away, and that the Family unit should be abolished.

This same man supported "Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels", which, after exhaustive mindnumbing reading of the Communist Manifesto, I've taken ti mean he would limit travel. Why would he do this? Because Communism can only exist in isolation. Under the Marxist theory a communist soceity would be contaminated by capitalist soceities. Captialist soceities would draw away the "best and brightest", because they can readily see they would be rewarded far more than at home.

[monkspider]

Azrael- I am not necessarily advocating religious communism, though true communism, in many ways, has it's roots in the various world religions, perhaps most notably christianity. Communism cannot ever be seperated from it's spiritual roots, and I certainly do not intend to force it to be. That said, true communism intrinisically advocates absolute tolerence and understanding toward everyone, regardless of their beliefs (or lack thereof) regarding religion or spirituality.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Lonestar
Why? DuncanK, why do you (obviously, based on your sig) support the Marxist line of Communism? This is a man who had stated that *your* private Property should be taken away, and that the Family unit should be abolished.

This same man supported "Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels", which, after exhaustive mindnumbing reading of the Communist Manifesto, I've taken ti mean he would limit travel. Why would he do this? Because Communism can only exist in isolation. Under the Marxist theory a communist soceity would be contaminated by capitalist soceities. Captialist soceities would draw away the "best and brightest", because they can readily see they would be rewarded far more than at home.

The means justify the ends. I don't agree with abolishing the family and religion, but I don't think we should just stop calling ourselves communists just becuase of minor things like that. Communists is a good term. To me it means living in a classless society where one class doesn't own the means of production and another class does all the work.

[DuncanK]

The power of the church definitely has to be dealt with before change can happen. The church has historically justified capitalism. It's the most dangerous propaganda machine.

[Az]

later, guys.

[Imran Siddiqui]

More changing of 'Communism' with 'my penis' is required here

[Jon Miller]

I agree a lot with you Monkspider

at times I wonder about the possibility of working from the ground up

as in start communes and th elike, and than take control of local government, than national government

Jon Miller

[Jon Miller]

if oyu tihnk about it, most (if not all) succesful families are communist in nature

I think that we should build upon this, as in think of the family as the fundamental communist unit

than we can have groupings along religious or ideological lines(communes)

Jon Miller

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
More changing of 'Communism' with 'my penis' is required here

It would make more sense that way.

[Ben Kenobi]

You might cause a split.

Of the communists?

They do that all by themselves.

DuncanK:

How is Christ against all organised religion? File your case with scriptural citations.

The power of the church definitely has to be dealt with before change can happen. The church has historically justified capitalism. It's the most dangerous propaganda machine.

What about prohibitions in the middle ages on usury?
Isn't interest an essential part of capitalism?

The means justify the ends.

Is this an essential part of communism? If so, there is no way Christ would be a communist.

Monkspider:

In fact, you make an excellent case for why we need to drop the term "communism". It obviously carries with it certain assumptions that are neither correct nor productive to our cause. In reality, to be a christian (that is, to be one that follows the teachings of Jesus) is to be a "communist", the natural conclusion of Christ's teachings would inevitably lead to a state of de facto communism.

One question. Do you believe that this state can be achieved by persons, without the intervention of God?

[The Andy-Man]

'Religeon is the opium of the Masses'
-Marx

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by DuncanK
Capitalism will fail economically. We will never convince a critical mass of people that capitalism is inferior until it becomes obvious, and then it they will be eager for the knowledge.

Great. Sounds fine to me. When capitalism fails, I will be waiting with open arms for your illumination.

Until then, I suggest that you spend your time on more productive activities.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by The Andy-Man
'Religeon is the opium of the Masses'
-Marx

so can anything else be

religion can also be used to help the masses

JKon Miller

[The Andy-Man]

Originally posted by cyclotron7


Great. Sounds fine to me. When capitalism fails, I will be waiting with open arms for your illumination.

Until then, I suggest that you spend your time on more productive activities.

Capitalism has and is failing. It is the cause of 200yrs of imperialism, mass world poverty - even in the USA. It is prone to periodic recessions, each getting progressivley worse and culminating in a catatrophie (1930's.....).

To say its a failure maybe going to far, but to say its a success is rather arrogant and short sighted.

[The Andy-Man]

Originally posted by Jon Miller


so can anything else be

religion can also be used to help the masses

JKon Miller

Religion is up to the individual, the state has no holy affiliation to anyone, and to say it rules in the name of god or some such rubbish is ridiculous. The state is there to serve humanity and better the human race. Not to dictate and lead life according to a narrow and easily misinterpreted set of values.