OK Pro-Abortionists...Case Study.

[Ramo]

Bod is a perfect example of why drinking and smoking while pregnant is a bad idea.

[tinyp3nis]

Originally posted by flash9286
how can Europeans suppor abortion and be anti-death penalty

I agree, i simply find it dumb that there are people who think all humans have the right to live. Everything has a value that can be defined, even human life. I support abortion and would like to have death penalty here.
Im not 100% sure but in Finland when you get sentenced for life, its like 12 years! Its even called that in finnish language!! (Elinkautinen=life long sentence). Also if someone tries to rob you and you kick his ass you're the bad guy!

Oh and Sonic, why dont you convince us that fetus is a person? Try to put feelings aside, if you can.

[germanos]

Re: OK Pro-Abortionists...Case Study.

Originally posted by Boddington's
Last night I was out watching a couple of football games when I saw a pregnant women smoking and drinking.

Are you pro-choice for the female to do whatever she wants to her body, or do you care that the baby will be suffering and either die or be born with alcohol- and smoking-related defects?

Personally, I think she souldn't be smoking or drinking, and that is consistent with my beliefs about abortion.

However, you ought to think it's her body and can do what she wants, regardless of any ill effects to the baby, in order to be consistent. After all, it isn't a proper human is it?

I'm strongly in favor that this women had been aborted a long time ago.

[Sonic]

tnyp3nis, he is biologically a person from a time sperm and women sexual cell united. Since than killing him would be a murder. This is not feelings, more like brain who indicates me that. I always thought about abortions as a contradiction of law. I was trying to think any pro-abortionist arguements, but all I could think of were plain stupid. On every issue I could find arguements (for example, I could say many anti-death penality arguements even I am pro-death penality myself), but on this one I've just couldn't. Law legalising abortions is the same as law legalising for example murders of all childs beyond 3 years old (if family thinks they actually doesn't wants them) would be. Again, all the same "arguements" would fit - that it's better to kill him than to allow him grow if parents doesn't have enough time for him, etc. However I do believe only very few of pro-abortionists would agree on this issue. Which just again proves pro-abortionists themselves are based on feelings, not brain. If they would be based on brain they would also agree on law legalising murders of childrens beyond certain age - the only place family can truly decide werether growing child for them is too "hard" or not is only when the child is born and they've seen all the downsides related with him.

[KrazyHorse]

he is biologically a person from a time sperm and women sexual cell united

No he isn't.

Since than killing him would be a murder. This is not feelings, more like brain who indicates me that. I always thought about abortions as a contradiction of law.

No it isn't.

Jesus, why not just label all of our beliefs as axiomatic? That way we can never be proven wrong...

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Sonic
However, once semen connects with women's sexual cell (don't know the name in ENglish, sorry), it becomes a person. Yes, it becomes a person exacly then, not when it is born.

If somebody is brain-dead on life support, do you consider it murder to take them off of life support?

[Sonic]

loinburger, no. I do consider braindying an end of life (well, biological end of life. By current technologies maybe it isn't exacly that, but I don't consider pullig of life support a murder).

Frogger, I proved my arguements and you didn't. Saying "no it isn't" is not an arguement at all.

[KrazyHorse]

Frogger, I proved my arguements

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Sonic
loinburger, no. I do consider braindying an end of life (well, biological end of life. By current technologies maybe it isn't exacly that, but I don't consider pullig of life support a murder).

So you believe that humans without functional brains are not truly people? And yet you consider the abortion of an unborn child to be murder, even though the unborn's brain doesn't function until the third trimester?

[KrazyHorse]

That's an interesting proof you've got there.

No, semen aren't people, because no person can be born only from semen. However, once semen connects with women's sexual cell (don't know the name in ENglish, sorry), it becomes a person. Yes, it becomes a person exacly then, not when it is born

A fetus becomes a person when it can survive outside the womb.

See? I can make assertions too...

[Sonic]

Frogger, re-read my post

Loinburger, main thing here is not a functioning brain - it's the fact that if not abortion unborn baby, even one from the first trimester, would in most cases become child, than an adult. While brain-dead person won't become living person anymore.

[KrazyHorse]

i.e. when it has independently functioning lungs, heart, digestive system etc.

[loinburger]

Originally posted by Sonic
Loinburger, main thing here is not a functioning brain - it's the fact that if not abortion unborn baby, even one from the first trimester, would in most cases become child, than an adult. While brain-dead person won't become living person anymore.

If "removing the possibility of a person coming into existence" is murder, then contraception and abstinence are also murder.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Sonic
Frogger, re-read my post

I just di and quoted the only "proof" I see.

It's something that has been stated hundreds of times here already. It has yet to be proven. So has my assertion about when a fetus becomes a person. Do you have some sort of mental block, or are you just playing dumb to avoid having to think?

[KrazyHorse]

I've heard that Lithuanians are the only people in Europe drunker and more depraved than the Danes. Is this true?