Sharon Acts!

[Panag]

Originally posted by DinoDoc


Because I happen not to like the murder of innocent men, women, and children. But whatever floats your boat, Imran.

These people are killing themselves. Ever ask why? Because they have nothing to live for.

Then why aren't you out there giving al Qaeda the same support, if suicide terrorism is enough to get it out of you?

hi ,

last line , some people stand up , other's like to talk from far away places , .....

have a nice day

[Imran Siddiqui]

This is boring. I've decided that I'm blaming capitalism for the ME debacle.

Ah, the che way .

I do not buy into the argument that Israel is just as guilty of terrorism as the Palestinian extremist groups.

How did you think they got their state? Israeli terrorist attacks caused the colonists (Britain) to wash their hands. Who do you think learned from this? Yes, the Palestinians.

I think that killing IDF soldiers is justified and suicide bombings WERE a brilliant strategy. These days it is just self-defeating. They should have ended it after 1993. Unfortunetly Rabin was killed (if he wasn't this whole thing never would have happened) and Netanyahu came into power, and the Pals realized they'd never have peace, so they went back to war.

Arrian, it's a war. Always been a war, and civilians are targetted in war. You can keep saying its wrong, but it has been done over and over and over again in history.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Because I happen not to like the murder of innocent men, women, and children. But whatever floats your boat, Imran.

So you stand up and say Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and Dresden are wrong? You say tar and feathering tax collectors in the revolution was wrong? I wonder if you would if you were there.

Then why aren't you out there giving al Qaeda the same support, if suicide terrorism is enough to get it out of you?

Cause Al Queda's cause isn't sufficient for me.

Comparing the Palestinian bombing to the Al Queda bombing is like saying America's involvement in Vietnam and the Gulf War for for exactly the same reason. Sorry, but I don't buy it.

[Panag]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

This is boring. I've decided that I'm blaming capitalism for the ME debacle.

Ah, the che way .

I do not buy into the argument that Israel is just as guilty of terrorism as the Palestinian extremist groups.

How did you think they got their state? Israeli terrorist attacks caused the colonists (Britain) to wash their hands. Who do you think learned from this? Yes, the Palestinians.

I think that killing IDF soldiers is justified and suicide bombings WERE a brilliant strategy. These days it is just self-defeating. They should have ended it after 1993. Unfortunetly Rabin was killed (if he wasn't this whole thing never would have happened) and Netanyahu came into power, and the Pals realized they'd never have peace, so they went back to war.

Arrian, it's a war. Always been a war, and civilians are targetted in war. You can keep saying its wrong, but it has been done over and over and over again in history.

hi ,

man you ought to get your history straight , ...
anyway , if you think that killing an other human is justified , well , see a doc , and while at it , ask yourself how you would feel when one kills your children , or parents , ....and then we shall talk , ...

and about the pals , if the outside interfering would have been stopped , and all them other fruitcakes where either in prison , or back to their country of origin , than there would be peace , ..

and the day that people stop to do what you are doing , talking like you do , then there shall be peace , ...

bye

[Arrian]

Imran,

If this thing was an all-out war in which Israel targetted civilians, it would all be over pretty quickly for the Palestinians. If the Israelis were willing to act like Nazis, the Palestinians could not stop them. So to claim that "this is a war and civilians get targetted in wars" in order to justify suicide bombing is a bull**** thing to do. The fact is that ONE SIDE is deliberatly murdering civilians here. The other, while a looooooong way from perfect, at least tries to hit the combatants.

As for your historical examples, again, none of those justifies what the suicide bombers are doing. Nothing justifies that.

-Arrian

p.s. Hmmm, there is a word in here that should have been censored, but wasn't. Wonder what I did.

[DinoDoc]

1) Strategic bombing during WWII was wrong and served no military purpose. The Palestinians should learn from its faliure. What's your point?

2) You seemed to see something particularly noble and worthwhile in the idea of preferential murder of a civilian population even when military targets are within reach. Hence, the al Qaeda comparison.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Bull**** isn't censored, only the end of it.

--

But it is a war. Israel doesn't want to persue it too much because then the US will take their funding away. That is the ONLY thing keeping Israel in line right now. If they didn't need US funding so badly, they'd already have rolled over Palestine.

And it might not be justified to you, but it is justified to the people sitting in Palestinian refugee camps, living in ****holes. So what are you going to do about that?

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
1) Strategic bombing during WWII was wrong and served no military purpose. The Palestinians should learn from its faliure. What's your point?

I'm surprised at this. I thought I had seen you post a defence of strategic bombing. I suppose I'm mixing you up with somebody else...

[Imran Siddiqui]

1) Strategic bombing during WWII was wrong and served no military purpose. The Palestinians should learn from its faliure. What's your point?

It was morally wrong? So you think Truman should have been tried for war crimes?

2) You seemed to see something particularly noble and worthwhile in the idea of preferential murder of a civilian population even when military targets are within reach. Hence, the al Qaeda comparison.

In order to throw off the yoke of colonialism, just about anything is justified, as history has shown us in Israel (when the Jews did it), Algeria, Vietnam, etc.

[Panag]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Bull**** isn't censored, only the end of it.

--

But it is a war. Israel doesn't want to persue it too much because then the US will take their funding away. That is the ONLY thing keeping Israel in line right now. If they didn't need US funding so badly, they'd already have rolled over Palestine.

And it might not be justified to you, but it is justified to the people sitting in Palestinian refugee camps, living in ****holes. So what are you going to do about that?

hi ,

hey man , come over and see for yourself , .....
even the so called rfugee camps have better living standards then anywhere else in the netire midle east , ....
or do you want to see some pics of what the egyptians did in gaza , zip , nada nothing , you have to pay to get on the net , they not , you have to pay for your medical aid , they not , you have to pay for many things , they not , ..... but you did not know this , so no hard feelings ,
actually since you know so much about the whole region , why dont you say this , ...
oh yeah , where else in the middle east can woman vote , bump , oops , nowhere ,

so , come over and see for your self , ....

refugee camps , care to tell the real story behind that , ...
why dont you talk about the many people we took in from syria , jordan , iraq , iran , q8 , saudi , libanon , egypt , and they all have dual citizen ship , with even more benefits then a guy who comes like a tourist , ...
and now , some of these people , who we pay and give food , like we would do with any other refugee , including you when you ask , they spoil their own house , just the fact that we give them a peace of land , or even talk about it , imagine you start to ask in the states for your own little country , you know what shall happen , some redneck , patriot shall shoot you , ...
imagine we start to do it , ...
oh yeah , did you forget to tell that yasser killed this year more then 216 palestians , on the charge that they where working with Israel , ......

bye

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
It was morally wrong?

It was militarially useless and quite possibly lengthened the war by stiffening the enemy's resolve to fight on and get revenge. Contemporary examples of this can be seen in the US response to 9/11 and in Israel. Again, I say that the Pals should learn from thier faliure and switch to another more successful tactic.

[Eli]

Panag :
The refugee camps are the source of the entire ME conflict. The conditions there are horrendous.

[Imran Siddiqui]

I didn't ask successful or not. I agree with you it isn't successful or not.

I'm asking did you think US actions were morally wrong?

hey man , come over and see for yourself

Don't have too. Many, many people who have been over there that I've spoken too attested to how the Palestinians were treated like 2nd class. It is one of the main reasons I came to see terrorism as somewhat neccessary in the 80s (the 1st intifada).

imagine you start to ask in the states for your own little country

People don't have too. We like to integrate everyone from every state. This is why we don't have a national religion. Israel is a Jewish state! How can you say that it can integrate people who aren't Jewish? You don't like Islamic states, so why should they like a Jewish state?

[Imran Siddiqui]

The refugee camps are the source of the entire ME conflict. The conditions there are horrendous.

I'm agreeing with Eli . Of course we might have different ends in mind.

I'd like to see a Democratically elected Palestinian state (with fair elections guarenteed by the US), but the first step is the recognition of the state. Otherwise, Arafat can just keep it a dictatorship, and he has every right to, I think. Until it becomes a true state, how can he just give up power? He might be rendering Palestine leaderless, depending on what Israel decides to do!

[Panag]

Originally posted by Eli
Panag :
The refugee camps are the source of the entire ME conflict. The conditions there are horrendous.

hi ,

check for yourself , and imagine , how and why , ...

10 years ago most where better , ...

now they just build , illegal , without respecting the building code , and you know that that one is one of the best in the world , without thinking of safety , without thinking "disposal" , .....
and the PA does nothing , .....grrrrrr

been to one last week , man , they really build like fools , ....

there was this electricity line , high voltage , very high , running in the garden , 2 meters above ground on the poles , in the middle a child hanging , ....
anyway , ELi , you know what , how and why , ....

have a nice day