Apple is becoming the next MS

[Asher]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Gotta love it when the pot calls the kettle black

'cept it's untrue, because I don't worship Microsoft, I don't buy everything they make (the only thing of theirs I buy is Xbox and Xbox games, come to think of it), and I frequently advocate alternatives to Microsoft products.

It's simple-minded idiots that dismiss my opinions as that of a fanboy, because their minds become overloaded when they ponder the thought that what I'm saying is perhaps objective and logical, and just disagrees with what they believe.

Windows is the best choice for consumer desktops. Period.

MacOS X is expensive and lacks software, with a flashy but questionable interface design.
Linux is inconsistent, lacks software, and is generally too difficult to maintain for a home user.

It's really that simple.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Asher
'cept it's untrue, because I don't worship Microsoft, I don't buy everything they make (the only thing of theirs I buy is Xbox and Xbox games, come to think of it), and I frequently advocate alternatives to Microsoft products.

It's simple-minded idiots that dismiss my opinions as that of a fanboy, because their minds become overloaded when they ponder the thought that what I'm saying is perhaps objective and logical, and just disagrees with what they believe.

You are less of a zealot than our vocal Mac users, but you are a fanboy nonetheless. I precisely remember you arguing how superior IE was to Mozilla/Firefox because tabbed browsing was so confusing for the average user. When you assess Microsoft products, I have never seen you calling one of their product pure crap (which you often do against the competition). And whenever Microsoft is attacked, you are very defensive, such as what you are doing in this thread. You are a fanboy, even though you are not a fanatical zealot

[Asher]

You are less of a zealot than our vocal Mac users, but you are a fanboy nonetheless. I precisely remember you arguing how superior IE was to Mozilla/Firefox because tabbed browsing was so confusing for the average user.

A few points:
1) At the time, IE was superior to Mozilla, and Firefox didn't exist
2) Tabbed browsing is confusing to the average user, which is why Firefox ships disabled with the new-windows-in-new-tabs option (my parents, for example, prefer new windows to new tabs).

When you assess Microsoft products, I have never seen you calling one of their product pure crap (which you often do against the competition).

Sure I have.
1) IIS is pure crap
2) SQL Server is pure crap
3) Windows ME is pure crap
4) "MSN" is pure crap

And whenever Microsoft is attacked, you are very defensive, such as what you are doing in this thread.

I only defend Microsoft when it's right to do so, because it's just so popular to mindlessly bash them.

For instance, in this case Microsoft is all about being open with their products and technology, and Apple is about locking you in. That's not so much defending Microsoft, as it is providing a reality check to how positions have reversed.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Asher
4) "MSN" is pure crap

Don't you use MSN ? I remember you flaunting the superiority of MSN, and I also remeber pics you posted which shoyed your pic in your MSN client.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Don't you use MSN ? I remember you flaunting the superiority of MSN, and I also remeber pics you posted which shoyed your pic in your MSN client.

That's MSN Messenger.

I'm referring to "MSN", like "MSN Basic" and "MSN Premium"...it comes with many ISPs these days.

It's an annoyingly skinned version of IE and Outlook Express.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Asher
The only difference between Apple and MS is Apple has a far stronger grip. It's that reason that Apple isn't nearly as large and successful as MS is, and it's that reason that they aren't in trouble with anti-trust issues.

Apple is Microsoft, but more evil, and they even have a cult of followers that worship them and buy whatever they sell.

There's an interesting book out now called the "Cult of Mac".

I fail to see what grip Apple has. You like apple and their store, you buy an ipod. You dont, you buy some other brand.

Windows i dont got that choice. Hell, as ive found over the years, you dont really got that choice with apps either. Our old PC came loaded with Lotus software, (Aptiva did that, you should know, asher) the Lotus software was great, till you actually had to exchange anything with anyone, where the incompatibilities with MS word and Excel always created headaches. Well im not making that mistake again. Despite yet another annoying bug in MS word, at work, that caused me to rekey part of a document, and that the orgs tech staff couldnt fix, I would still insist on MS apps, lousy or not, cause of the grief if i dont. Now THATS a grip.

[Asher]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
I fail to see what grip Apple has. You like apple and their store, you buy an ipod. You dont, you buy some other brand.

Windows i dont got that choice.

Yes you do, you can use Linux or buy Apple.

If the majority of people use one format, and your software isn't compatible with it, that's not Microsoft's fault, nor its problem.

It's a totally different situation, one is the product's popularity "forcing" you to buy one of MS' products...and in Apple's case, it's Apple's greed preventing any competition from finding ways to be compatible with them to provide customers a more reasonable price for the music store.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Asher

Yes you do, you can use Linux or buy Apple.

If the majority of people use one format, and your software isn't compatible with it, that's not Microsoft's fault, nor its problem.

It's a totally different situation, one is the product's popularity "forcing" you to buy one of MS' products...and in Apple's case, it's Apple's greed preventing any competition from finding ways to be compatible with them to provide customers a more reasonable price for the music store.

Its called a network economy, and to the extent that MS has tried to reinforce that dominance, it IS MS's fault. And it results in less choice than Apples 'lockin".

Its not MS's problem? No its MS value proposition, is what it is. Its my problem, and the problem for millions of others, and its Gates fortune. The majority uses "one format" = but theyre locked in the same way I am.

Remember the PC i told about earlier? I had to buy windows cause my firm did. THEY had to buy windows, cause their clients, with whom they exchanged data, did so. Its an iron grip.

[Asher]

It's the market's grip, it's not MS' grip.

It would be MS' grip if they sued you for using another Office program on Windows and intentionally updated Windows to stop competitor's program from working on it. That's what Apple is doing here.

Do you see the difference?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Asher
It's the market's grip, it's not MS' grip.

It would be MS' grip if they sued you for using another Office program on Windows and intentionally updated Windows to stop competitor's program from working on it. That's what Apple is doing here.

Do you see the difference?

Its the path dependence. Calling it the markets grip implies that the market is currently making the choice. And MS benefits from it, and except where antitrust settlements stop it, encourages it.

Apple benefits from no path dependence. Its easy to buy a competitors product.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Gotta love it when the pot calls the kettle black

People don't buy MS because it's a cult.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
People don't buy MS because it's a cult.

True, but that has nothing to do with my comment

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker


People don't buy MS because it's a cult.

i thought people bought apple products cause they like the look, and cause theyre easy to use, and are willing to pay more.

[Atahualpa]

It's a totally different situation, one is the product's popularity "forcing" you to buy one of MS' products...and in Apple's case, it's Apple's greed preventing any competition from finding ways to be compatible with them to provide customers a more reasonable price for the music store.

The problem is market dominance. Anyone dominating the market will dictate users.
However the cure for market dominance is the market itself. Within enough time reasonable alternatives will pop up. Things such as WineX emerge that make the "old" things compatible with the "new" ones and given enough time the market will divide more equally.
I don't want to give any dates on when Windows will have a significant market loss or what will be the "successor", it's just that eventually there will be one.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Atahualpa


The problem is market dominance. Anyone dominating the market will dictate users.
However the cure for market dominance is the market itself. Within enough time reasonable alternatives will pop up. Things such as WineX emerge that make the "old" things compatible with the "new" ones and given enough time the market will divide more equally.
I don't want to give any dates on when Windows will have a significant market loss or what will be the "successor", it's just that eventually there will be one.

What makes me think that the demise of the PC will come first?