The OFFICIAL United States Presidential Election Thread! IV

[Ned]

Originally posted by Theben


I wish I could see things through the rose-colored glasses you have. Where can I get some?

Theban, I assume from your post is at in your view a truly free press is found in the likes of Cuba where so-called right wing propaganda never sees the light of day.

[Theben]

I can understand how you've reached that conclusion, but you need to tell the voices in your head they're wrong.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Theben
I can understand how you've reached that conclusion, but you need to tell the voices in your head they're wrong.

[Theben]

Bah. All this talk about Bush and Kerry, and the REAL story is left alone.

Nader Supporters Blame Electoral Defeat On
Bush, Kerry

WASHINGTON, DC—Supporters of presidential candidate Ralph Nader blamed his defeat Tuesday on George W. Bush and John Kerry, claiming that the two candidates "ate up" his share of the electoral votes. "This election was stolen out from under Mr. Nader by Bush and Kerry, who diverted his votes to the right and the left," Nader campaign manager Theresa Amato said. "It's an outrage. If Nader were the only candidate, he would be president right now." In his concession speech, Nader characterized Bush and Kerry as spoilers.

[Ming]

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Its time for: Trump says your fired!!

SCENE: A corporate boardroom. Four nervous-looking candidates take their seats at a big table.

DONALD TRUMP enters, flanked by his two corporate lieutenants. He sits across from the candidates.

TRUMP: All right. I gave you all a task to perform. It was a difficult task, but you lost. You had to organize a political campaign, bring your message to the public, energize your base, win over independent voters, and then prevail in the most hotly-contested presidential campaign in fifty years. You lost. What went wrong?

JOHN KERRY: Well, as a Vietnam veteran, who served in Vietnam fighting with the Vietnamese against the North Vietnamese--

TRUMP: Hold on, before we get started, I should introduce my assistants. Carolyn you all know.

(Carolyn nods icily.)

TRUMP: Now George is away on business again, so this week he was replaced by... who did we get this week, Carolyn?

CAROLYN: Blackie Lawless, lead singer of W.A.S.P.

BLACKIE LAWLESS: 'ello, 'ello!!!

TRUMP: I gotta be honest, I have no idea who the hell you are.

BLACKIE: I was on the original Disciples of Darkness tour with Ronnie James Dio and Glen Danzig.

TRUMP: That really helps me not at all. Anyway, John. You lost. You were the project manager. Do you deserve to be fired?

KERRY: Absolutely not. As a Vietnam veteran, I know what it takes to make tough decisions. And also how to not make tough decisions, and how to avoid decisions while sounding tough. That is the lesson of Vietnam. As a young man I defended this country--

TRUMP: John.

KERRY: Hm?

TRUMP: I'm going to stop you there, John, before you go any further. The whole Vietnam thing. It's all you ever talk about. It was thirty years ago, John.

KERRY: It's seared-- seared -- into my memory.

TRUMP: John, at this point your Vietnam experience is seared into my memory. I have to tell you. It's just one bullet-point on your resume. A lot of men have been in Vietnam. I was in Vietnam. Tell him about my tour in Vietnam, Carolyn.

CAROLYN: Uhhh, I don't think you ever fought in Vietnam, Mr. Trump.

TRUMP: Well I've seen movies. Tell him about the Vietnam movies I watch.

CAROLYN: Um, which one?

TRUMP: You know. The one I like. Where they're living in a house right on the Pacific Ocean, and they've got a speedboat and a bunch of cool cars, and they have this little nerdy friend who has a little robot pal he calls "Roboz."

CAROLYN: That's not a Vietnam movie. I think you mean the mid-eighties action series Riptide.

TRUMP: That's the one. It was a living hell. Thank God Nixon got us out of there when he did.
(adjusts tie; turns to another candidate)
You. You're quiet in all this. What do you have to say for yourself? Should you be fired for this loss?

MICHAEL MOORE: I don't think so.

TRUMP: Why not? What did you contribute to the team?

MOORE: I wrote, directed, and starred in the highest-grossing documentary of all time, a film that bravely exposed the corruption and incompetence of the Bush Administration. I won the Palm d'Or at Cannes, I swept the balloting at the Golden Globes, I won the--

TRUMP: Can I ask you a question?

MOORE: Yes.

TRUMP: While you were winning all these awards, did you ever think to yourself, hey, maybe I should shave once in a while? Maybe, you know, tuck my shirt in? Maybe I could afford to drop a couple dozen pounds? Appearances count in business, Mike.

MOORE: I dress as what I am. I'm a proud son of blue collar parents, a lifetime resident of Flint, Michigan--

TRUMP: Mike, you live in one of my buildings. You pay me rent every month. I know, because you're always trying to pay me in buffalo wings.

MOORE: But my primary residence--

TRUMP: Is a half mile away from my breathtaking Maya Largo estate in Palm Beach. We belong to the same country club. You practically live at the aromatherapy spa. So, you know, knock it off with the working class hero crap. And, quite frankly, working class doesn't mean obese and unkempt.
(unsure; turns to Carolyn)
It doesn't, does it?

CAROLYN: It's not required, no.

TRUMP: That's what I thought. Because I know I see a lot of working class women that are in pretty damn good shape. Not as beautiful as my beautiful fiance Maritza, of course. But still-- they put themselves together pretty nice. I'd take a run at them, I'll tell you that.

BLACKIE LAWLESS: I have a question for Mike, Mr. Trump.

TRUMP: Shoot.

BLACKIE LAWLESS: ARE YOU -- READY -- TO -- ROOOOCKKKK?!!?

(Mike seems stunned and frightened)

TRUMP: Well, are you, Mike? Are you ready to rock?

MIKE: I, uh, don't know. I don't think so.

TRUMP: Does that answer your question, Blackie?

BLACKIE: I have nothing further.

TRUMP: And that's a key to success in business, Mike. If someone asks you if you are ready to rock, you have to be prepared without a moment's hesitation to say, "Yes sir, I am ready to rock. And rock hard." But you don't rock. You're a schlub, Mike. And that documentary you made, Mike? What was that all about? That turned people off, Mike.

MIKE: I won the New York Critic's Cirlce award for--

TRUMP: Mike, it was a bad documentary. Half of what you said wasn't true and the other half was just you walking around in your big-and-tall-man's jeans and annoying the crap out of people on the street. A good documentary presents a compelling factual narrative, moving people to take interest in a worthy cause. Like that documentary I like. What's that documentary I like, Carolyn?

CAROLYN: I'm afraid I need more information.

TRUMP: You know, the one where they live in a beach house in Malibu and solve crimes by driving around speedboats and clowing around with their little robotic chum.

CAROLYN: Ummm... do you mean Riptide again, Mr. Trump?

TRUMP: Riptide, that's it. Chilling stuff. Powerful. Moved me to actual tears.
(beat)
All right. Outstanding. Now we're really getting to the heart of this fiasco. Now, you. You over there. Who are you again?

JOHN EDWARDS: I'm Senator John Edwards of North Carolina, Mr. Trump.

TRUMP: I can't have two Johns in the boardroom. It's too confusing. I'm just going to call you Tina. Now, Tina, where the hell were you when all of this was going on? I don't remember you doing anything to bring this task to a successful conclusion.

"TINA": I gave my media-approved "Two Americas" speech at many rallies, I --

TRUMP: Yeah, but what the hell did you actually do, Tina? Talking is one thing. But business is about doing.

"TINA": I, well, I did what I was asked to do. If I was underutilized, then that's the project manager's fault.

JOHN KERRY: I didn't underutilize you. In Vietnam I learned--

TRUMP: Save it, Sergeant Rock. I'm talking to Tina. Business is about being a self-starter, Tina, and going where the action is. But you just sat around and looked pretty. And I admit you are pretty. You're like a clean-cut Shaun Cassidy. Or like that one, the youngest brother of the Bee Gees, the one with the beautiful hair. You know the one, Carolyn.

CAROLYN: Andy Gibb.

TRUMP: No, not Andy Gibb. You know, the youngest brother of the Bee Gees, the good-looking one, the one who drove around a Corvette and helicopter and solved crimes as part of a beachfront detective agency.

CAROLYN (cocking head like a serpent): Uhhhh... you mean, um, Perry King, star of Riptide?

TRUMP: Exactly. Perry King. It's too bad he died so young. I think he had another Shadow Dancing in him. He will be missed.
(beat)
So, anyway, Tina. I like you. I think you're pretty. I'd love to take you to my beautiful mansion in the Hamptons some time and dress you up in Christian Dior originals. But I really don't think you added anything to this team.
(looks around the table)
And I guess that leaves you. Now you-- you really screwed up. Blackie tells me he was embarassed for you, and he's a fifty year old man wearing ass-less chaps.

DAN RATHER: Mr. Trump, I went above and beyond the call of duty to bring this project to a successful conclusion.

TRUMP: Right. You put those forgeries on the air. Kind of ended up hurting the cause, didn't it?

DAN RATHER: I did my best. I'm a Texas newsman, Mr. Trump, and I go to where the story is, no matter who might be angry about. Not the White House, not political partisans on the Internet--

TRUMP: Dan, I've gotta be honest. Those were some really bad forgeries. They were ridiculous.

RATHER: We put them through the most intense fact-checking possible--

TRUMP: Dan, one of them was scribbled on the front of a Taco Bell tray-liner. It said that George Bush was to be suspended for flying for failing to complete a required gordita. And it gave the name of his Air National Guard unit as "Extra Spicy." I've seen better work, Dan.

RATHER: I've had forty years in the business--

TRUMP: Do you think maybe you've had ten years too many, Dan? Be honest. It didn't take much to prove you were wrong. It just took those, what do you call them--

CAROLYN: Internet bloggers.

TRUMP: Right. It just took a bunch of unpaid, untrained internet bloggers to show that your documents were hoaxes. They just had to do a little bit of research, then drive around in Corvettes while sending their little robot friend out to collect clues and then they were back at the beachhouse drinking beer within an hour. Like on that show.

CAROLYN: Riptide.

TRUMP: No, that's not the one I'm thinking of. The one with Nell Carter. Gimme a Break. That's it. She had sass.
(beat)
Anyway, you embarassed your team, Dan. You made your team look foolish in front of the public. And that's an unforgiveable sin in business.

(thinks; then sums up)

TRUMP: So I don't know here. It's a tough call.

I've got one guy who thinks that Inna Gada Da Vida is still tracking on the Billboard charts.

I have another guy who apparently works in a donut shop and takes his work home with him.

I've got "Tina," who quite frankly I'd like to date after I divorce my lovely fiance Maritza, which I think will probably be sometime next spring, but who contributes nothing except a dazzling smile and a killer set of gams.

And then I've got this sad old buffoon peddling cheap hoaxes on national television, making a complete jackass out of himself and an entire news organization.

(music rises, tensely)

TRUMP: But in the end I think there's only one decision possible.
(points quickly, but vaguely)
You're fired.

(silence)

JOHN KERRY: Ummm... who's fired? Which one?

TRUMP: All of you. You're all fired. You've all been incompetent, useless, vicious, dishonest or outright corrupt from start to finish. You're all fired, and I don't want to ever see any of you in public life again. You can leave now. Out.

(slowly and sadly, the stunned candidates exit the boardroom)

(Trump ponders his decision, then discusses it with his aides)

TRUMP: I think I did the right thing.

CAROLYN: You had to do it. It was an easy call.

BLACKIE LAWLESS: None of them are qualified to run one of your companies, Mr. Trump. Or a network news division. And certainly not the United States of America, the greatest country on the face of God's earth.

TRUMP: That's very well put, whoever the hell you are. And what do you think?

ROBOT BUDDY: It was the logical outcome. Keeping any of them would not have computed.

TRUMP: Thank you, Roboz. You know how much I depend on your counsel. Now, let's get back to the beach house and track down those counterfeiters.

CAROLYN: I'll prep the chopper.

TRUMP: You do that. Team, it's time to rip it.

(end scene as they all dash towards a speedboat)

Link

[Drake Tungsten]

Man, Ace really hit the jackpot with that one...

[Bosh]

Originally posted by Ned


Reminds me of a debate on TV here between a Democrat black leader and a Republican black leader as to who blacks in the US should support and why. The Republican black leader talked about the social issues and said that blacks needed to support Bush. The Democrat leader talked about the Iraq war and the unbalanced budget. He sounded like an echo of that day's Democrat talking points. He never once said anything that pertained to blacks in particular. Not once.

Once clued into this, I begain to pay attention to other Democrat black leaders. Ditto. They all sounded like shills of the national campaign and never once alluded to anything blacks cared about.

So when you say that Bush is unpopular because of the Iraq war in Korea, I see a pattern that seems to hold equally as well here in the US. The Iraq war has almost nothing at all to do with Korea just as it has nothing at all to do with blacks in America. But one's attitude about the war can be swayed by the way the media reports what is going on in Iraq and what we are fighting for. It seems to me that the media outside the US is uniformly hostile to the Iraq war and never reports what is going on in Iraq without some dire negative spin. Never.

Nothing to do with Korea?
Well aside from the Korean who got his head chopped off in Iraq, Korea is now a target for terrorist organizations and has been receiving terrorist threats from the islamic world for the first time ever. Koreans are not happy about this.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Theben
Bah. All this talk about Bush and Kerry, and the REAL story is left alone.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Theben
I can understand how you've reached that conclusion, but you need to tell the voices in your head they're wrong.

Well, Theban, it was not me who questioned whether a press that included FOX News, et al., was free. If it is your contention that you were not slamming right wing media in some fashion, I am all ears.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Boshko

Nothing to do with Korea?
Well aside from the Korean who got his head chopped off in Iraq, Korea is now a target for terrorist organizations and has been receiving terrorist threats from the islamic world for the first time ever. Koreans are not happy about this.

So now you are mad at Bush because you are helping us in Iraq? What are you really mad about -- that you need US support at all?

[Arrian]

Memo to Ned:

Boshko is an AMERICAN. He happens to be in Korea and is attempting to educate you on the opinions of Koreans. So, first off, don't argue at him as if they're HIS opinions.

Second, I think what he said was rather straighforward. Koreans do not like the downside of helping us out in Iraq. There is no ulterior motive needed for that. Granted, I think they *DO* resent the need for our help (if there really is a need for that anymore, which I question), but that goes to the Korean nationalism Boshko was talking about earlier.

-Arrian

[Ned]

Originally posted by Arrian
Memo to Ned:

Boshko is an AMERICAN. He happens to be in Korea and is attempting to educate you on the opinions of Koreans. So, first off, don't argue at him as if they're HIS opinions.

Second, I think what he said was rather straighforward. Koreans do not like the downside of helping us out in Iraq. There is no ulterior motive needed for that. Granted, I think they *DO* resent the need for our help (if there really is a need for that anymore, which I question), but that goes to the Korean nationalism Boshko was talking about earlier.

-Arrian

Arrian, one's government joins the coalition, one would expect the anger to be at the government's leaders, not Bush.

That the anger is towards Bush is telling.

[Arrian]

Yes, it is. It's telling that just about everywhere you go in the world, the people are overwhelmingly anti-Bush.

You will, I know, choose to twist that into somehow meaning that foreigners are at fault. Others will assume the exact opposite.

Whereas neither is true. Bush has generated a lot of hatred. On the other hand, some of the hatred currently directed at him/us is latent anti-Americanism that goes back a long ways before Bush. There is fault on both sides of the international divide.

However, since Bush is my employee, and the others are not, my complaints are directed at him (which appears to be your point - the S. Koreans should be *****ing to their government. Actually, I think they ARE), and I leave the foreigners to deal with their governments.

-Arrian

[Ned]

Originally posted by Arrian
Bush has generated a lot of hatred. On the other hand, some of the hatred currently directed at him/us is latent anti-Americanism that goes back a long ways before Bush. There is fault on both sides of the international divide.
-Arrian

Regardless of how one stands on Iraq, you will have to admit that the foreign press, with a few exceptions, is enormously hostile to Bush. This has to got to cause a lot of the negative feelings among foreigners. If you disagree, imagine if the foreign press were uniformly praising Bush instead?