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Elian 4 year later

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  • #31
    Originally posted by GePap


    If the father wanted the child back, most certainly, since child custody is a matter of the law. So in the end, economic situations have little to do with it. The very fact that people fought to keep elian had much to do with politics, NOT sentiment.

    I would respectfully say that for the Cuban community in Miami politics and sentiment were (and are) inseperable. Their concern for Elian, a child, was inseperable from their view of Cuba, a country with which they were intimately involved, so that glib (if valid) comparisons to China did not move them. Given that they did so care, and were fighting to keep Elian, the rest of us had to react to that. That some chose to react with sympathy to the Miami family is not necessarily more political than that some chose to sympathize with the boys father (assuming that was really what he wanted) though the law may have been on the side of the latter.

    To the cuban community in Miami, and to many of the rest of us, the notion that the father was acting under duress from the Cuban govt was not at all fantastic, and i dont know that its disproven to this day. Its hard to imagine a comparable situation wrt to Mexico or Brazil. It is very much possible to imagine such a situation wrt China - an extended family taking a child in, a father possibly under duress asking for custody - but geography militates against a similar situation wrt to China.
    "A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber

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    • #32
      Originally posted by lord of the mark
      Arent we harsh on Haitians and Mexicans for precisely the economic reasons that did not apply to Elian because he DID have an established, middle class extended family eager to take him in?
      They weren't middle class. They were lower class thugs and conmen. It was a family of petty criminals.
      Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

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      • #33
        Originally posted by GePap


        You mean, just like the Exile Leaders in Miami would have used this kid to humiliate Castro until he died?
        Yes they would have. However after he was 18 he would be able to leave Miami and start out on his own. In Cuba no change in heII will he be able to leave. The Cuba Gov. will be watching this kid for a very long time.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by lord of the mark
          I would respectfully say that for the Cuban community in Miami politics and sentiment were (and are) inseperable. Their concern for Elian, a child, was inseperable from their view of Cuba, a country with which they were intimately involved, so that glib (if valid) comparisons to China did not move them. Given that they did so care, and were fighting to keep Elian, the rest of us had to react to that. That some chose to react with sympathy to the Miami family is not necessarily more political than that some chose to sympathize with the boys father (assuming that was really what he wanted) though the law may have been on the side of the latter.
          And I would respectfully say I don't give a **** about what the Cuban Miami community wants, thinks, or cares about- they don't set immigration policy, asylum policy, nor child custody law. This was a matter of custody. The law on that was blatantly clear.

          To the cuban community in Miami, and to many of the rest of us, the notion that the father was acting under duress from the Cuban govt was not at all fantastic, and i dont know that its disproven to this day. Its hard to imagine a comparable situation wrt to Mexico or Brazil. It is very much possible to imagine such a situation wrt China - an extended family taking a child in, a father possibly under duress asking for custody - but geography militates against a similar situation wrt to China.
          Yes, its hard becuase it WOULD NEVER COME UP WITH A FATHER FROM THOSE COUNTRIES. no questions would be asked if the father asked for the kid back. And if family in the US fought it, it would hardly get press and be resolved arther simply, since the law is crystal clear.
          And again, conspiracy theories about the father "being pressured" mean nothing, and are nothing more than that, cheap and worthless speculation.
          If you don't like reality, change it! me
          "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
          "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
          "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Joseph
            Yes they would have. However after he was 18 he would be able to leave Miami and start out on his own. In Cuba no change in heII will he be able to leave. The Cuba Gov. will be watching this kid for a very long time.
            Only if you think Castro has 10 years or more of life left in him. That regime won't last long after the old man dies.
            If you don't like reality, change it! me
            "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
            "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
            "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by GePap

              And again, conspiracy theories about the father "being pressured" mean nothing, and are nothing more than that, cheap and worthless speculation.
              come now, they wouldnt let him come to Miami without watchers from the Cuban Secret service, IIRC.
              "A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Joseph
                I started this thread to show that Castro is using this kid to thumb his nose at the USA and noting more. I don't think Castro gives a shlt about this kid.
                And you do? You're only using the kid for political reasons, hypocrite.
                Last edited by chequita guevara; August 2, 2004, 18:01.
                Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by GePap


                  And I would respectfully say I don't give a **** about what the Cuban Miami community wants, thinks, or cares about- they don't set immigration policy, asylum policy, nor child custody law. This was a matter of custody. The law on that was blatantly clear.



                  Yes, its hard becuase it WOULD NEVER COME UP WITH A FATHER FROM THOSE COUNTRIES. no questions would be asked if the father asked for the kid back. And if family in the US fought it, it would hardly get press and be resolved arther simply, since the law is crystal clear.
                  And again, conspiracy theories about the father "being pressured" mean nothing, and are nothing more than that, cheap and worthless speculation.
                  However it was reported at the time the Father was a member of the party.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Joseph
                    However it was reported at the time the Father was a member of the party.
                    What difference does that make?
                    Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by lord of the mark
                      come now, they wouldnt let him come to Miami without watchers from the Cuban Secret service, IIRC.
                      Wasn't mentioned at the time in the Press or Apolyton.
                      Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Commies are child fiddlers. Well known fact.
                        Rethink Refuse Reduce Reuse

                        Do It Ourselves

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Joseph
                          However it was reported at the time the Father was a member of the party.
                          As Che said? So what? If anything, it means he would in general have a better life in Cuba than non-party members.
                          If you don't like reality, change it! me
                          "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                          "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                          "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            I love how it's perfectly acceptable to steal a man's kid because he lives in a Communist country, but if someone who could provide a better life for your kid came along and tried to take them, you'd shoot them. Hypocrites.
                            Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              political alignment is no basis for determining weather or not someone can be a good parent... I think Che will be a good dad, [troll]and most parents who kill their kids are Democrats while most Young Repubs are driven to suicide or killing their classmates[/troll]
                              Monkey!!!

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                              • #45
                                Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...

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