Slot Machines

[Urban Ranger]

We got a pro here

[Dis]

and yet. I gamble every now and then.

One reason I'm not a major gambler despite living in Las Vegas is I hate losing money . I'm cheap.

But I do game megabucks every now and then. We don't have a lottery. this is my best be to win several million dollars . But I never put in more than $20. And I only do that once every 6 months or so. Sometimes even less than that.

I used to play blackjack. But the best I can do ther is break even. But it's still a fun game. It has more interaction than staring at a video screen.

The funny thing is I make fun of people who spend hours and hours staring at slot/video poker machines. Yet I go home and play computer games for hours on end

But I lose less money playing computer games. And they are more interactive and require more brain power.

[Urban Ranger]

If you play slot machines, poker etc. for entertainment, it's okay. As long as you are not addicted or think you can make money from gambling.

Did you just say you made $20,000 once?

[FrustratedPoet]

He said he paid it out to someone else. From the sounds of it he works in a casino or something. Not a lot else to do in Vegas I guess, unless you're a hooker or a guy with his own Bengal tiger.

[*End Is Forever*]

Nothing to stop machines being set to 98% or greater in order to reel in the customers... Stew will remember Nudge Banker in the Trafford Centre which could almost always be guaranteed a (small) win, and I've noticed that newly-arrived machines tend to get progressively less "hot" as they age...

[Solly]

New machines are always good ones to play. Whether it's because they are set higher to begin with in order to entice customers, or whether a few novices try a few quid and inevitably lose because they don't know the machine yet, I don't know.

Slot machine playing isn't so much skill as experience. Firstly you can build up experience of a particular slot, and then next you build up experience of slots in general play.

American slots might play different to British slots, I don't know. But I can guarantee you that if you did an experiment with two pots of money, such as..

Pot A, £100: pump the machine with £10 and don't take any wins

Pot B, £100: takes over the machine after that £10 pumping from Pot A and gets what it can.

I can assure you Pot B will return with a good profit.

Of course the trick is to make other punters your "Pot A" and watch them fill the machine for you, so that the machine needs to pay something out in order to return to its payout average percentage.

[Tingkai]

Did you even read what Dissident wrote.

[Solly]

Yeah and what he said obviously doesn't apply to British machines.

These do hit hot and cold streaks. And no the customer if you take him as the group of all those who play on slot machines can not win. However, individual customers within the slot machine playing group can win.

[Gibsie]

I also play British machines sometimes (I never put more than a few quid in at once though), and PA is absolutely correct, there are "hot" and "cold" streaks. There have been times when I have done things ridiculously stupid and ended up losing my win, and then one or two goes later I get another one.

In the airport on my way to Germany, my score was about...
£3 in > £2 out
then I went on some crappy pusher slot machines and got about 30p back from a pound, went back on the first machine...
£1.40 > £6

I was happy with that. Although it could have been £10 if the lights had been working properly, as I was allowed to "choose" a win from five attempts and I though I was no the £5 win when I said collect but it was really only £1. Oops.

[Ming]

The law of averages indicate that things will run hot and cold. And that there will indeed be "streaks". But, these are random in nature... And yes, you will win if you are "lucky" enough to be playing a machine when it eventually pays out.

However,

Pot A, £100: pump the machine with £10 and don't take any wins

Pot B, £100: takes over the machine after that £10 pumping from Pot A and gets what it can.

I can assure you Pot B will return with a good profit.

You can assure no such thing. Sometimes it will work, and sometimes it won't... it's a matter of luck. As stated, everytime you "pull the handle" the odds of any given event occuring are the same.

[Cruddy]

Originally posted by Dissident

No machine is set above 98% payout.

You can't win. period.

Unless... you're the person that owns and operates the machine?

[East Street Trader]

I have seen slot machines beaten.

Once.

When I was a student. The machine in the pub began to misfunction and paid out every time. Dishonestly we all exploited this until - eventually - it got noticed and fixed.

Which illustrates a point. Waiting until a machine is "due" is a losing game. There are two possibilities - either the machine is set up properly in which case the chance of a pay-out is just exactly the same on each and every pull of the lever - wholly uninfluenced by the pulls that went before. Or the machine is misfunctioning and, in this case, not paying out enough.

If you see a machine pay out three times in a row - don't decide it is now not "due" for a while. Maybe your chance on the next pull is just exactly the same (bad) chance as you get when it is functioning properly but maybe, like the one in the pub, it is misfunctioning favourably to you.

Coming at the same point in a different way - the big win on the machine in my bridge club builds up steadily as it is played. Until someone wins. Now it might seem that the time to play the machine is when the jackpot has not been won for a while and has built up to a goodly figure.

But consider that with a gamesplayer's eye. This is the very thing the person who designed the machine and who operates it is relying upon. The feature is exploiting human nature and greed. But of course the motive of those people is to make money which means to maximise the money making its way through the machine and thereby the slice skimmed off the top on the way through. So if you see a machine with a nice big jackpot you know that it is programmed to pay out the jackpot win rarely enough to ensure that the jackpot figure displayed is mostly high and only rarely so low as to deter players.

If there is another machine with a more modest jackpot it is true that the prospect for a really big win is lost - but, on the available evidence, a gamesplayer may nevertheless conclude that the raw percentages are more likely to be less (ludicrously) unfavourable on that machine.

One last point. Some figures are bandied about in the thread for the percentage cut to the house.

When you see such figures there is a feature to be allowed for. It is time. So, for example, roulette is a fastish game. A lot quicker than poker. The percentage favouring the house therefor gets applied in roulette many more times over the same period as in the case of poker.

Craps is said to be faster but slot machines are the faster of all. Even a very small edge, in percentage terms, gets to have the best chance to work itself out to the maximum benefit of the house in such a case.

I find the machines insulting - with their flashing lights and rapid, deeply trivial, decision making. And would not play them for that reason alone. But if you have anything of the gambler about you the other reason not to play is that to do so makes you a sucker.

[Solly]

"As stated, everytime you "pull the handle" the odds of any given event occuring are the same."

You're wrong again. This isn't a random roulette wheel. It's got programming and it's got average payouts to meet by law.

Which means that if its taken £50 without paying a thing, it's pretty damn likely to drop pretty soon (ie odds of it paying now are a lot higher).

I don't see why you fail to understand this Ming.

Maybe it is a subtle difference between American and British machines, I don't know.

But I've played hundreds of different slots and know they play better once they've absorbed a bit of money off someone else.

[Solly]

Mybe it's because the jackpots are lower here on our pub slot machines (recently gone from £15 to £25), and that they only hold at maximum £100 in pound coins.

I get the impression you're thinking of the huge payout machines, like $10,000 jackpot or something...

[East Street Trader]

You are misunderstanding the legal requirement. There is no rule that requires any specific payout over a specified timescale. As long as the machine is set to pay out at least 70% of the money it takes in it is lawful.

If some particular machine - honestly set up - failed to pay out a single penny for a decade that would no doubt be a minor statistical freak but it would not give rise to a prosecution.