Announcement

**General Ludd** · June 9, 2004, 11:32

Re: Slot Machines

Originally posted by Park Avenue
Any hints and tips?

Bring lots of money with you.

And don't expect to leave with any.

**SlowwHand** · June 9, 2004, 11:34

You're on the right track. Watch for someone playing a long time without winning; or a machine in general that hasn't paid out, no matter how many people played.

**East Street Trader** · June 9, 2004, 11:34

Do some remedial arithmetic.

**Cruddy** · June 9, 2004, 11:57

Well Bods, I can tell you that a couple of "real" (ie successful) programmer friends of mine will never play the things - after working for a company that serviced them.

You see, before you've put the money in, they've decided if there's a chance of paying out or not.

In the UK, the govt sets the minimum payout of 70% of what you put in.

Of course, that doesn't mean even over a whole lifetime you'll get back exactly 70% of what you put in...

...But every time you put money in, that's the proportion of cash you can expect to get back.

The odds can be skewed if the operator has "stoked" the machine not to pay out at 70%, or the other way if it's malfunctioning or has recently been compromised by a professional gambler...

... A gambling compulsion can cost your money, your self respect, and your life. Set limits, BE ABLE TO WALK AWAY - and you;ll probably be OK.

Personally, I only play them when;-

a) I NEED money (typically to get public transport home).

b) I have SOME money but not enough.

c) If I crap out and lose the lot, it's walkable.

**reds4ever** · June 9, 2004, 12:16

Originally posted by Cruddy

In the UK, the govt sets the minimum payout of 70% of what you put in.

thats what I find funny, it has to say by law on the machine what percentage it pays out. it tells you "If you stick a hundred quid in, I will give you 70% back!!!!!" and people still play the things

the only way to stand a chance is to let a mug feed it for a couple of hours and then jump in when he goes to the bar for change*

*This strategy is adopted at your own risk, I have seen fights break out when people use this method

**East Street Trader** · June 9, 2004, 12:17

A thing I have never been able to work out is whether the person is playing the slot machine or the slot machine is playing the person.

You can certainly support the proposition that it is the machine which initiates everything much easier than the alternative. What with all those (really rather insulting) flashing lights and so on.

I am (or have been) a gambling man. I would be ashamed of being seen trying to buck the 1.25% house edge on a European single zero roulette wheel (well, unless the girl is very pretty). The notion of bucking a 30% house percentage nearly makes me ill.

(As for national lottery tickets, I have to avert my eyes and say an earnest prayer for my species if I see someone buying one of those.)

Oh, and incidentally. If you see a coin tossed thirty times and it comes down heads each time, for God's sake show half an ounce of sense and bet on heads for the thirty-first. The past never has predicted the future but, at least, if it really IS a double headed coin you are doing nothing foolish.

Unless this is all happening on a street corner, another guy makes the bet and wins, and about three guys in the audience with accents not a million miles apart from the coin tossing guy start urging you on as to what easy money it all represents. In that case keep your hand on your wallet as you walk away.

**reds4ever** · June 9, 2004, 18:22

Originally posted by East Street Trader

I am (or have been) a gambling man. I would be ashamed of being seen trying to buck the 1.25% house edge on a European single zero roulette wheel (well, unless the girl is very pretty). The notion of bucking a 30% house percentage nearly makes me ill.

Yep, roulettes a bad bet and it's STILL a lot better than the slots!

A bookie works on 15% (ish) profit per race/game/fight so betting on a sport you know something about gives you better odds than slot machines

**Kuciwalker** · June 9, 2004, 18:32

Re: Slot Machines

Originally posted by Park Avenue
Anyone play these things? Any hints and tips?

...

You just put coins in and pull a lever, right? How much strategy can there be?

**reds4ever** · June 9, 2004, 19:22

Re: Re: Slot Machines

Originally posted by Kucinich

...

You just put coins in and pull a lever, right? How much strategy can there be?

Nope, they're more 'complicated' now, instead of pulling a lever to get 70% of your money back, you have to press loads of buttons and watch flashing lights.

It makes the punter think he's got more control........

**KrazyHorse** · June 9, 2004, 19:36

the only way to stand a chance is to let a mug feed it for a couple of hours and then jump in when he goes to the bar for change*

I'm pretty sure this "strategy" is bollocks.

The machines don't pay out a bunch after they've been paying out nothing; each pull of the lever is guaranteed (by the laws in the jurisdictions I'm familiar with) to be completely independent of the last.

In other words it's like thinking that you're making a good bet on flipping tails because you've just flipped ten heads in a row. Probability doesn't work that way.

**reds4ever** · June 9, 2004, 20:00

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
In other words it's like thinking that you're making a good bet on flipping tails because you've just flipped ten heads in a row. Probability doesn't work that way.

The major, and I mean MAJOR, hole in that argument is that 'heads' (ie. house win) is allowed by law to only come up 70% of the time.

Slot machines don't work on probabilty math, they work on 'x is paid in = y is paid out' it's just a matter of catching them right.

When tossing a coin and getting 100 heads, no-one is saying to the coin "by law, you need to come up tails sometime soon".

Geddit?

**KrazyHorse** · June 9, 2004, 20:07

Originally posted by reds4ever

The major, and I mean MAJOR, hole in that argument is that 'heads' (ie. house win) is allowed by law to only come up 70% of the time.

Slot machines don't work on probabilty math, they work on 'x is paid in = y is paid out' it's just a matter of catching them right.

Geddit?

Actually, I'm pretty sure this is wrong.

The law could simply require them to have a random number generator which gives the sucker a 70% return. In fact, this is the only system which makes any sense. In other words, putting in a hundred dollars does not guarantee a 70 dollar return; that 70$ return is simply an average.

The only system which would ensure that exactly 70% of the money was returned is the one which takes in 1$ and spits out 70 cents every time. Not very exciting.

**reds4ever** · June 9, 2004, 20:10

Originally posted by KrazyHorse

each pull of the lever is guaranteed (by the laws in the jurisdictions I'm familiar with) to be completely independent of the last.

Not in the UK, see

404 Not Found

http://www.fairplay-campaign.co.uk/fruit/

**reds4ever** · June 9, 2004, 20:13

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
In other words, putting in a hundred dollars does not guarantee a 70 dollar return; that 70$ return is simply an average..

Yep, it's just getting to the machine after its 'up', it needs less money to get it's average. I don't think probabilty math has much to do with it?

Announcement

Slot Machines

Slot Machines

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment