Noah's Arc

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Arrian


Religion, particularly when looked at from the viewpoint of a historian (or in my case someone who studied history as an undergrad), does not inspire any trust in me at all. Rather, it tends to disgust me. History is full of examples of unscrupulous men who used the word of God or whatever to convince fools to kill each other or to give them their money. It's so obvious that faith blinds people.

So you're saying that if one is a historian one cannot be religious? Damn it -- and here I thought I was a Christian even though I'm a History major.

And to focus exclusively on the rotten people within the different religions through human history without looking at the contributions these religions made to their civilization's culture is extreme biased, distorted history.

Also, about being "blinded" by one's faith. I would vouch that it's mostly extreme fundamentalist of any religion that have disdain for scientific thought and inquiry. Most other mainstream religious people have found their own way to have faith in God while appreciating what science has to offer.

[Arrian]

So you're saying that if one is a historian one cannot be religious?

You have problems with reading comprehension, don't you? I will repeat myself, slowing, with the main point in all caps, so you get it this time: RELIGION, particularly when looked at from the viewpoint of a historian (or in my case someone who studied history as an undergrad), DOES NOT INSPIRE TRUST IN ME AT ALL.

Note the "in me."

And to focus exclusively on the rotten people within the different religions through human history without looking at the contributions these religions made to their civilization's culture is extreme biased, distorted history.

Religion has done good and bad throughout history, but I wasn't trying to assign blame or call religion evil. What I was saying is that History is full of examples of the consequences of blind faith.

I would vouch that it's mostly extreme fundamentalist of any religion that have disdain for scientific thought and inquiry. Most other mainstream religious people have found their own way to have faith in God while appreciating what science has to offer.

Of course. Many scientists are also religious. Somehow they reconcile their faith with their scientific studies. And that's fine by me. But there were are couple of fundies (or rather a fundy and his DL) in this thread, and it was primarily to them that I was addressing my post. Well, them and the peanut gallery, as always here on 'poly.

Anyway, consider your objection on the part of reasonable Christians logged, MrFun.

-Arrian

[MrFun]

Ok -- I get the "me" part that I missed.

[Arrian]

Sorry if I came across a bit, um, testy, there. It's Monday morning, and I'm a tad grumpy.

-Arrian

[MrFun]

Nah -- it's my fault for not reading your post more thoroughly.

[Arrian]

Hmm, we're getting along too well. This is 'poly OT!

Let's see if I can stir something up...

Returning to the point about the good religion (or religious people) has done throughout History, it is certainly my impression that the good is outweighed by the bad.

This is also the case with just about any "cause" that has its foundation in faith. Because faith can be used to circumvent logic, it is particularly useful to those who would like to have people doing all manner of things to futher their ends. There's nothing more dangerous than a zealot, except perhaps the person who knows how to manipulate the zealot. It doesn't have to be limited to religion at all.

But so far in human history, it is religious zealotry that has been most abundant. Perhaps in thousands of years, non-religious "isms" will have overtaken religions as the primary home of zealots, but we've a long way to go before that happens.

So, when you allude to the good done by religion, I'll grant you that some good things were done (saving manuscripts during the Dark Ages, charity work, etc). However, I still think that on balance, religion has had a negative effect on humanity.

Bring it.

-Arrian

[Docfeelgood]

I don't believe in atheists.
Never seen one

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Arrian
Hmm, we're getting along too well. This is 'poly OT!

Let's see if I can stir something up...

Returning to the point about the good religion (or religious people) has done throughout History, it is certainly my impression that the good is outweighed by the bad.

This is also the case with just about any "cause" that has its foundation in faith. Because faith can be used to circumvent logic, it is particularly useful to those who would like to have people doing all manner of things to futher their ends. There's nothing more dangerous than a zealot, except perhaps the person who knows how to manipulate the zealot. It doesn't have to be limited to religion at all.

But so far in human history, it is religious zealotry that has been most abundant. Perhaps in thousands of years, non-religious "isms" will have overtaken religions as the primary home of zealots, but we've a long way to go before that happens.

So, when you allude to the good done by religion, I'll grant you that some good things were done (saving manuscripts during the Dark Ages, charity work, etc). However, I still think that on balance, religion has had a negative effect on humanity.

Bring it.

-Arrian

Well, being a gay man, I definitely know the dangers of fundamentalists.

[Docfeelgood]

your gay?

[Japher]

Docfeelgood, that is a common misconception

[Docfeelgood]

misconception

[Japher]

MrFun thinks he's gay, but many of here think otherwise since he scares off all the men he dates...

[Docfeelgood]

[Docfeelgood]

I cannot see where wood would still be perserved after sush a LLOONNGG time.

[Docfeelgood]

This one is more plausable