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Gadaffi now an ally?

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  • #46
    Northern Africa and especially the Algerian coastal populations ( Lybia too, with the right standard of living ), can be opened up to the west. It's very very probable. Now having people like Buteflika, and Qaddafi there as our allies for change is problematic for three reasons:

    a) They're are murderous *******s ( But when fighting folks like the GIA, I don't think that you really blame buteflika on that one.)
    b) They won't always play along, since their aims aren't personal freedoms for their citizens, war on terror or the like, but power, mostly ( again, In Qadaffi's case, We can't really be sure. The guy is so intoxicated by power, that he's a riddle, really)
    c) They are relatively weak, in their position. When they die, a ****storm may arise, and put all assets in great risk. This is esp. true in Qadaffi's case.
    urgh.NSFW

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    • #47
      I would have to agree. Giving something to Gadaffi shows (to other "bad guys") that being reasonable can lead to favorable outcomes.
      No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.

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      • #48
        He's in good company. Along with the likes of the House Saud, Musharraf, Karimov, Mubarak, and soon enough al-Bashir (we've been making overtures towards Sudan lately), he's another ally of ours that's a great advocate of freedom in the region.
        "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
        -Bokonon

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        • #49
          What do you think about the French boy Buteflika, Ramo?
          urgh.NSFW

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          • #50
            notyoueither, we're not on the same frequency. I never said Gadaffi can't come with the info. I said let's hear it. I never said he can't open up the country. I'm saying, we should never offer him our alliance and make him personally benefit, or in other words bribe him for the information.

            I repeat, if he has information, he should come forward with it and fight terrorism. He keeps back, he supports terrorism and is looking for hand outs for his info.
            And yet there are people who defend him here.

            If that's the way to go, we can't ever talk about 'you are either with us or against us' anymore. Or 'if you harbour terrorist' or help them anyway, you would be against us. That's just gone with the wind.

            We can still gain, if he comes forward we'll gain. If he decides not to, he just sealed his faith, and we should kidnap the bastard and get the info out or what ever, but then they just declared war from the terrorist side to us.
            In da butt.
            "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
            THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
            "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

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            • #51
              He's a bastard too.
              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
              -Bokonon

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              • #52
                Well, all of them are, really. But what would you do if you had to fight the GIA?
                urgh.NSFW

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                • #53
                  The army has had just as little regard for human life as the GIA and FIS. I don't think that's what it takes to crush militant Islamism.
                  "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                  -Bokonon

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                  • #54
                    AFAIK, the army doesn't "clean up" entire villages.
                    urgh.NSFW

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                    • #55
                      Sometimes it does (there's been some testimony about security forces participating in these massacres), although it's true that's more the realm of the Islamists. However, the magnitude of total repression is comparable. There've been countless, countless numbers of "disappearances," extra-judicial killings and so forth attributed to the army.
                      "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                      -Bokonon

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                      • #56
                        And the Islamists scalp their victims alive, and torture them. Don't you remember the movie of what happened when an Army convoy came under attack? They're ****ing merciless. Sort of people I'd gladly kill.
                        urgh.NSFW

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Pekka
                          Giancarlo, You didn't address my points I made at all. You only started insults.

                          Do you think there is a difference between ex-terrorist and a terrorist? I don't.

                          I never said we should turn our backs if he has something to say. If he wants to open up his country, sure why not. But he shouldn't get any benefits from telling the information. Withhelding the information he is helping terrorists.

                          In I'm too tired even to debate about this, because we're talking about Gadaffi, and not some lesser guy. No support for terrorists what so ever, in any form.
                          I'm calling you a nescient, unforgiving fool. If we had you in charge of foreign relations, we might aswell nuke Libya. He is not only telling information.. he is opening his country up.
                          For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)

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                          • #58
                            Oh yes Lord Praise Gadaffi the Righteous

                            Like I said many times, let's hear what he has to say, let him open the country up, and offer nothing back.
                            In da butt.
                            "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
                            THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
                            "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

                            Comment

                            • #59
                              And the Islamists scalp their victims alive, and torture them. Don't you remember the movie of what happened when an Army convoy came under attack? They're ****ing merciless. Sort of people I'd gladly kill.
                              I agree with you on that (except for maybe the killing part ). All I'm saying is that the army is the same way. In fact, I'd say that the Algerian gov't is one of the most oppressive in the world.
                              "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                              -Bokonon

                              Comment

                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Pekka
                                Oh yes Lord Praise Gadaffi the Righteous

                                Like I said many times, let's hear what he has to say, let him open the country up, and offer nothing back.
                                You said that we would have to be unreasonable with him and possibly drive him into a Kim Jong Il type of disaster. If you ran the world, there would be many Kim Jong Il like rulers.
                                For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)

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