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Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
Stupid comments this far in advance rarely decide elections. This one will be decided by 1) the economy and 2) Iraq.
Yep. Unless a candidate admits to murder, or sodomizing sheep on a courthouse steps late at night, nothing said before the conventions will really have an effect on the general election.
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."
Ask when you're looking for a job, and your unemployed ass doesn't have any money to spend on the crap that's made overseas.
Sorry, I have my bases covered in the whole job field. Even if I can't find a job in my field of study (a possibility, to be sure), I have numerous fallbacks that will suffice.
If someone else doesn't have those fallbacks, then I suppose one could say that I made better choices earlier in life than some other people did. In other words, tough ****.
In any case, you still didn't answer my two questions, which were 1)what's wrong with corporate profits? and 2)what else is the point of business?
Sorry, I have my bases covered in the whole job field. Even if I can't find a job in my field of study (a possibility, to be sure), I have numerous fallbacks that will suffice.
If someone else doesn't have those fallbacks, then I suppose one could say that I made better choices earlier in life than some other people did. In other words, tough ****.
In any case, you still didn't answer my two questions, which were 1)what's wrong with corporate profits? and 2)what else is the point of business?
Yeah, yeah, whatever, Mr. stuck in a bottle of beer is so prescient that he knows his entire employment history already.
1) Nothing's wrong with corporate profits, if you take into account the appropriate timeframe and risks associated with your level of profit. Short term profits which erode prospects for long term growth or which are based on risks which didn't happen to materialize at the time aren't the same as short term profits which are consistent with long term growth. Don't believe me? Ask Enron.
2) If you don't know, I'm not going to waste my time educatiing you. Profit as a be all and end all point of business is a gross oversimplification.
When all else fails, blame brown people. | Hire a teen, while they still know it all. | Trump-Palin 2016. "You're fired." "I quit."
2) If you don't know, I'm not going to waste my time educatiing you. Profit as a be all and end all point of business is a gross oversimplification.
Sometimes experience is the only way anyone learns. Some people, you just can't reach
Which side are we on? We're on the side of the demons, Chief. We are evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the forces of death to spread devastation and destruction wherever we go. I'm surprised you didn't know that. --Saul Tigh
Yeah, yeah, whatever, Mr. stuck in a bottle of beer is so prescient that he knows his entire employment history already.
Yes, there is a possibility that at some point I will be unemployed. However, I feel that as a result of my experience in retail, I can always go back to that as a fallback, if necessary (worked in the retail field for the past five years, mostly full time in supervisory roles). This isn't to say that is a good career, but rather that even if I do become unemployed, or have trouble finding a job in my field, I would probably stand a very good chance at being employed in some field.
No, I don't know my entire employment history. I do know my work ethic to date, and my work experience to date, and my intelligence, and those factors tell me that I don't have as much to worry about as certain other people.
1) Nothing's wrong with corporate profits, if you take into account the appropriate timeframe and risks associated with your level of profit. Short term profits which erode prospects for long term growth or which are based on risks which didn't happen to materialize at the time aren't the same as short term profits which are consistent with long term growth.
Naturally.
And if you want to bring up Enron and other corporate scandals, I can only reply that I assume you know my position on fraud. I would think that people would assume, by now, that when I ask "What's wrong with _____?", I mean "What's wrong with ______ if achieved morally/" And by "morally", I believe that everyone knows I mean "without coercion" and "consistant with freedom".
So, then, outsourcing jobs is not immoral. It cannot be said to be either coercive or inconsistent with freedom - laid off workers have no inherent right or entitlement to their job, and by taking the job when offered were simply entering into a contract which all involved parties knew was not necessarily permanent. Now, if laying off workers violated a clause of some contract they may hypothetically have had with the company, that's another matter. Since that is not typically the case, we can ignore it. If outsourcing jobs is not immoral, then the only relevant question a company needs to ask is "What will this do to profits?" Obviously, as you point out, long-term profits should be weighed as well, but in any case, this question of business decisions is certainly not the business of anyone but the company and its shareholders.
2) If you don't know, I'm not going to waste my time educatiing you. Profit as a be all and end all point of business is a gross oversimplification.
Fine, then to avoid this argument, let me simply rephrase.
Is the primary function of a business to make a profit, or is the primary function of a business to provide jobs? Yes, the two (profits and jobs) are obviously intertwined - hence one reason for oursourcing jobs to places with cheap labor
If companies don't benefit then why would they do it?
Price competition. As AS states...
Several people seem to be missing the point that profits are competed down to normal levels, thus passing the gains on to consumers.
As to...
Remaining employees. That's cold comfort to those who aren't retained.
This is a cold world. No doubt about it. But history indicates that over time these people will find work on an equal or greater payscale.
I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891
But history indicates that over time these people will find work on an equal or greater payscale.
working wages have stagnating since the more egaltarian 60's and early 70's
This corporate shift is competely retarded... if consumers don't have jobs, they can't buy your stupid products.
I just wish these dopey corporations could see past their own bottomline for once.
But I'm not terribly discouraged. If things keep getting worse and worse for the American people, it will spark a revolution... and the corrupt crony capitalists will be hanging from the trees and burning in pits.
"If things keep getting worse and worse for the American people, it will spark a revolution... and the corrupt crony capitalists will be hanging from the trees and burning in pits."
Just what do you teach kids these days... look at your growth figures for the last twenty years.
Bush didn't lose the election, because the whole focus will be on Iraq, homeland security and abortion / gay marriage during the campaign.
And Spiffor gets it.
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Just what do you teach kids these days... look at your growth figures for the last twenty years.
yeah and compare growth to wages... with inflation, wage buying power for working and lower-middle class have gone down. If you think GDP growth is reflective of American quality of life, then yer a dope!
Originally posted by DanS
This is a cold world. No doubt about it. But history indicates that over time these people will find work on an equal or greater payscale.
No it doesn't. Almost every "where are they now" study I've seen of manufacturing workers who lost their jobs in the early 90s were worse off a decade later. Today, most of those who lost their jobs in the tech crash haven't yet managed to find employment in their old fields and will likely never again get such a well paying job. I'm one of the lucky few.
Christianity: The belief that a cosmic Jewish Zombie who was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh and telepathically tell him you accept him as your master, so he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake to eat from a magical tree...
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