Ten Commandments unconstitutional!

[Az]

Pop quiz: when did the ancient greek city state 'system' emerge?

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Azazel
Pop quiz: when did the ancient greek city state 'system' emerge?

I don't know. That is why I was asking others... I always sucked at Ancient History.

[Az]

http://www.crystalinks.com/greekhistory.html

Archaic Period (750 - 500 BC) -

The period in which the beginnings of Greek monumental stone sculpture and other developments in the naturalistic representation of the human figure are found. During the Archaic Age the Greeks developed the most widespread and influential of their new political forms, the city-state, or polis . Rise of the aristocracies. Greek colonization of Southern Italy and Sicily begins.


Archaic Period
Early Archaic Period
The Archaic colonization
The emergence of the Polis

Also, I don't actually know of laws that would make all men, including the Athenian oligrachy equal before the law. in Hebrew law, everyone was equal, since it was before god.

[Ben Kenobi]

Wish I could answer your question, Fez.

I don't know where the concept originated as to the equality of persons.

That is where the mix of state power and religion takes you.

MtG:

They used to burn Mennonites in Europe for 'heresy', so you don't need to drill this point home. Up until the last little while, you would never see a politically active Mennonite, just becuase they were afraid of violate their concept of a church seperate from the state. They also fear, as do I, putting the state above God.

I agree that one ought not to establish a religion, but I'm not sure having the Ten Commandments in a public building would do so.

[Ben Kenobi]

Fez:

My bad. The Framers would not have supported an equality of persons, since they endorsed slavery.

However, I do know Wilberforce cited biblical arguments against slavery as a rationale against the slave trade.

In fact, the US Coinstitution is, if anything, a repudiation of the Law of Moses. As MikeH and Stuie have already pointed out, the only Mosaic laws that correspond with US laws are those that pre-date Moses himself; the Law brought by Moses is exactly what the framers didn't want, and what they wrote out in the First Amendment.

Rufus:

Would the framers have cited their reason for being against murder based on these precedents, or on the Ten Commandments?

[Giancarlo]

The US Constitution is not a repudiation of the Law Of Moses.

This is a secular country.

[Ben Kenobi]

Is Christianity a single religious preference? Tell that to Jack Chick and Fred Phelps, who insist my Catholic anti-Christ pope loving ass is hell-bound.

Who was Christ descended from? What is the historical origin of Christianity?

It is mere semantics to claim there isn't a great common heritage between the two religious systems.

MtG:

I don't deny the heritage. What I do deny is that they are the same religion. In any other context we would talk of the differences between the two, why is it here, that they would be considered the same?

As for Phelps, he is a self-ordained 'reverend' so why should we listen to him? I would argue that Christianity is a single religion, we all believe in Jesus Christ as the Son of God. It is this difference that divides us from the Jews, and binds up all the Christians.

I don't think you are hell-bound, and I doubt any Christian would, just for loving Catholics. If that were true, I'd be right with you.

[Giancarlo]

As long as you keep your religion away from me, I am cool with you.

[Japher]

Hey Fez! What's your address I want to send you a Book of Mormon

[Giancarlo]

Wrong thing to send to a queer kid.

[Berzerker]

in Hebrew law, everyone was equal, since it was before god.

Umm...King David did some horrible things like ordering the husband of the woman he wanted for himself into a battle only to order the other troops to fall back as the victim's wave of soldiers led the charge.

[Berzerker]

Fez, you just keep repeating your nonsense without answering questions or responding to points.

Keep the garbage away from my eyes and others who do not share your beliefs. You have basically no right to infringe your beliefs onto others by placing it on government property. The State is secular therefore any religious material is not fitting and not helpful in conducting state business.

You don't have a right to have all religious objects removed from your sight where ever you go, try looking elsewhere if the crucifix offends thee. That stone monument does not "infringe" beliefs upon you, there was no law requiring passersby to stop and read it. And you've got it wrong, the state is merely prohibited from passing laws respecting an establishment of religion. Aside from the fact you mistakenly think "secular"ism means you can never be "offended" by seeing religious monuments, can you find the word "secular" in the Constitution? I'd love to see where this "right" of yours to have everyone else remain silent about their religious beliefs whenever you venture onto public property came from.

Treaty of Tripoli

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Berzerker
Fez, you just keep repeating your nonsense without answering questions or responding to points.

You fool, this country isn't a ****ing theocracy.

You don't have a right to have all religious objects removed from your sight where ever you go, try looking elsewhere if the crucifix offends thee. That stone monument does not "infringe" beliefs upon you, there was no law requiring passersby to stop and read it. And you've got it wrong, the state is merely prohibited from passing laws respecting an establishment of religion. Aside from the fact you mistakenly think "secular"ism means you can never be "offended" by seeing religious monuments, can you find the word "secular" in the Constitution? I'd love to see where this "right" of yours to have everyone else remain silent about their religious beliefs whenever you venture onto public property came from.

Treaty of Tripoli

Listen keep the **** in your house and off government property. G-o-v-e-r-n-m-e-n-t property is not a ground for religious bull****.

Go ahead and put the crap on your own property... but don't mess around with the government I also live under. This country isn't for you to put up monuments about Christianity in government areas where other people of different beliefs have to go.

[Berzerker]

You fool, this country isn't a ****ing theocracy.

The fool is the person who thinks a chunk of stone makes this country a theocracy.

Listen keep the **** in your house and off government property. G-o-v-e-r-n-m-e-n-t property is not a ground for religious bull****.

So you'd remove all religious symbols from Arlington Cemetary?
Congress opens it's sessions with prayer, does that "infringe" upon your "right" to have a "secular" government? There is a massive stone cross on Mt Davidson in San Francisco visible from miles away, remove that too? Why are you free to express your opinions on public property but no one else can express a religious opinion? You're quite the little dictator...

[Giancarlo]

[QUOTE] Originally posted by Berzerker


The fool is the person who thinks a chunk of stone makes this country a theocracy.

So you'd remove all religious symbols from Arlington Cemetary?

No but I am talking about government buildings where people who are living go to.

A Cemetary is for those who die, and they should have their own beliefs respected for the little plot in the ground where they are buried.

Congress opens it's sessions with prayer, does that "infringe" upon your "right" to have a "secular" government? There is a massive stone cross on Mt Davidson in San Francisco visible from miles away, remove that too? Why are you free to express your opinions on public property but no one else can express a religious opinion? You're quite the little dictator...

You have no right to **** with me or my beliefs. Keep your religious nonsense away from me and those who actually believe in freedom.

Putting stones of religious nonsense on government buildings is infringing on those who are not religious or of different religion.