Has the Bush administration signaled the end of conservatism?

[Whaleboy]

Sorry, I had to say something. (not what you expected).

This is a lame troll. There is nothing inherently wrong with conservatism, its a folly to say that because of a load of mess ups which are more attributable to human failings than anything wrong with a particular philosophy.

Still.. go liberalism! But thats irrelevant here . Incidentally sky, not everything that isn't conservatism is communism .

[Kidlicious]

Conservativism has always been an ideology thats purpose is to maintain the status quo of the elite. The idea that it is a ideology that benefits the common person is nothing but BS. There are plenty of people who have fallen for this BS, but I'm not one of them. This is no troll.

[Berzerker]

Bush is conservative? What liberal program has he eliminated? What liberal program has he cut? And please don't tell us a cut is a slower increase in expenditures than what liberals want because then anyone can advocate spending more on a program than liberals only to then accuse liberals of being greedy conservatives.

[Whaleboy]

Kid: Not entirely, its an element. Still, I don't care anymore!

[Berzerker]

Kid, you show your compassion by handing out other people's money and then accuse your victims of "greed" if they don't applaud when you rip them off.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Berzerker
Kid, you show your compassion by handing out other people's money and then accuse your victims of "greed" if they don't applaud when you rip them off.

So

[Ming]

Originally posted by Kidicious
It's not ignorant at all. I believe that to believe the opposite is not to understand reality. Tell me why a greedy person would be a liberal... but why would a regular Joe Liberal be greedy. Tell me.

Then your beliefs are totally mistaken.

A liberal person who wants more and more money from the government through social programs is greedy

Again... political beliefs aren't the measure of greed.
The INDIVIDUAL is...

If you don't understand that... there is probably alot of things you are mistaken on

And you never did answer the question... what do you do for charity... NOTHING? If so, then you are the selfish one... proving your argument is garbage

[Whaleboy]

Why do I agree with Ming?

You can't have a political system that is inherently more greedy than another. Hell, even if you could, you'd have to define greed objectively, which is something I for one, am incapable of.

[Elok]

Come to think of it, has there been a politician from either side within the past twenty years who couldn't be described as "greedy" somehow? I can't think of one, since Jimmy Carter was a little bit before then, and he wasn't exactly an ideal leader from what I understand.
If you're arguing that the common people who take liberal or conservative views are "greedy," then you are simply making a statement about people you have never met. It seems to me that the representatives of just about ANY ideal that get major attention on the news get there because they are either so polarized that a third of their audience watches in zealous admiration and the rest are looking for material to attack with (e.g. Limbaugh), or else so bland or vague or common-sense as to win a shrug and a thumbs-up from all types of people (Drug Abuse Is A Problem, We Need Education Reform, Strict Islamic Law Is Not The Answer). Complex and well-considered opinions generally cannot be reduced to sound-bites of sufficient size that the average viewer can take them in, decide off-the-cuff whether they agree completely or wish to kill the proponents of said opinion, and store their firm and reassuring opinion away in time to catch the commercials. So most of what gets aired is oversimplified vomit or inarticulate platitudes; it's a sad fact that people who do their job properly and professionally don't earn much in the way of ratings.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Ming
And you never did answer the question... what do you do for charity... NOTHING? If so, then you are the selfish one... proving your argument is garbage

I live on charity bud. And I'm not trying to get rich doing it. I'm just trying to survive. No one should have to worry about that. I'm not trying to make someone else rich and make you poor. I'm trying to eliminate suffering. You have a very strange opinion of what motivates people who think differently from you.

[Ming]

Even if you have no money... you could volunteer your time to help people... so just how are you trying to eliminate suffering... by whining... because you obviously aren't doing anything REAL to do so.

You are the one that has the strong and incorrect opinions of people. While I state greed is an individual trait, and not based on political labels... and make no claims of who is greedy and who isn't... you are the one trying to prejudge people you have never met based simply on their political party... so you are the one that is making bad assumptions... not me.

Again... you do nothing to help other people... and judge people that do give their time and money as greedy. Maybe you should look in the mirror when you are calling people greedy....

[Ned]

I think this thread is mainly about economic conservatism. Bush is conservative in this regard only in one respect - taxes. He is conservative in no other respect.

He does appear, however, to be the most socially conservative president in some time. I was just trying to think of a more socially conservative president in US history, and I can think of none.

As to foreign policy, being aggressive in defense of American values and interests is very typical of "Southern" Democrats. I think of Jefferson, Jackson, Pope, Roosevelt (was he really born in the North?), Truman, Kennedy (vastly different from most Northern Democrats) and Clinton. Neoconservativism is really the old Democrat Manifest Destiny in new jargon.

I just wish to note that Bush is a Texan.

[Whaleboy]

Even if you have no money... you could volunteer your time to help people... so just how are you trying to eliminate suffering... by whining... because you obviously aren't doing anything REAL to do so.

I gave £5 to a homeless man when I was out last night, and when we walked past him again, he asked for more, obviously having forgotten. He said he'd spend it on breakfast, not alcohol . Therefore, I am not a greedy liberal!

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by elijah
He said he'd spend it on breakfast, not alcohol .

I own a bridge in New York that I'd like to sell you.

[Whaleboy]

DD: YAY!!!!