It's all about oppurtunity...

[Pekka]

Uhh.. I sense this will get ugly soon. Stay in your foxholes, sit tight.

[Ming]

They still have a choice. They can sell their home, and rent one instead, while using the money from the sale to start their own business... again choices... using your resources properly. Short term, worse living conditions... long term... bigger house and more money.

And I didn't get "lucky" in advertising... I "earned" my degree in college, and I'm an expert on the subject and I'm asked to speak at universities and industry events... so

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Japher
Kid; if I attacked you or your father in anyway, I do apologize...

No need to apologize.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Choicing to do low value added jobs and not being displined at savings will often mean people end up with few financial assets. It's a choice some people make.

You can't just ignore luck. Or you can but you won't get very far in your argument. Just saving as much money as you can is not going to improve you lot. If you make risky investments you may get rich, but it is by no means a sure thing. Most people who make risky investments lose everything they saved. Now if you just put your money in a savings account today you can draw about 2% interest. You are unlucky because about 10 years ago people were making about 3 times that.

[Japher]

You can't just ignore luck

I agree; you can't ignore luck. Yet lucky to some who saves is hitting a 100% stock increase in one year.

Would you rather have of saved $10,000 or $1?

Return (or loss) is proportional to investment, luck or not...

[:) Smiley]

Another problem is that the kids themselves often don't have any encouragement to learn. They don't want to get off their #@$@# and pull themselves up.

A friend told me how US students in relation to the industrialized world are in the middle of the pack in fourth grade, near the bottom in 8th, and at the bottom in 12th.

The US middle school system is a colossal failure in education, as there is no motivation at all to do well, since regardless of your performance you go to the same high school. In high school some people start to shape up, but for many it's kind of late to catch up on three lost years.

American government propaganda is also pointing in the wrong direction. When the economy went bad a couple years back, the US government encouraged consumer spending to boost it. Comparitively, faced with the same situation the Taiwanese government implemented a national education program to teach everyone English. In Taiwan a "recession" is when economic growth drops below 5% a year.

True, the Asian meritocracy system does have severe shortcomings, and without a doubt the average childhood there is much harder than that in the USA, but 22 years down the line, when people enter the workforce, you see the results. Also, the system is much more egalitarian as the best schools and universities are public. High schools compete with each other across counties for the best students. Failure cases are rarely caused by lack of money, instead, lack of effort. It is even said that the wealthier students are the worse they do, as they have the money to waste time on recreation. For reasons I don't fully understand, perhaps due to early conditioning, the children their have a much higher tolerance for hardship, despite a decent standard of living.

What is most interesting though is a series of social feedback loops that encourages parents to do a good job. This began hundreds of years ago in imperial civil service examinations, where those who did well would be given well paid government jobs, and benefits would extend to the family. Unlike in Western society, inheritance works up, not down, the family tree. The same works for control over children- traditionally the grandparent has the final say, not the parent. The desire to maintain a good family name also feeds into this.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Japher


I agree; you can't ignore luck. Yet lucky to some who saves is hitting a 100% stock increase in one year.

Would you rather have of saved $10,000 or $1?

Return (or loss) is proportional to investment, luck or not...

Risk is also a factor. The average return has little to do with the actual return to each investor with risky investments. That's where luck is a factor. So where you may have the largest return is where you have made the riskiest investment. Also where you have lost the most you have also propably taken the largest risk.

[Ming]

That's why it's important to have a good mix in your portfolio... It's ok to take a lot of risk as long as it isn't all your money. Diversification is key to a good long term earnings plan

[Odin]

Good post Smiley. I think the problem with our schools is that we too many regulations on how teachers can and can't teach. I also think the way schools treat students makes them feel inferior (in my school teachers can drink beverages in a classroom with carpet and we can't). Also, I think science classes should be made more fun.

[MrFun]

Opportunity . . . . .


Last year, I worked as a volunteer at a local museum, in their historical archives. I did not know how my volunteer work would pay off later, but I knew that I was getting some kind of major-related work experience.


And behold, over six months later, I was interviewed for a postion in the Illinois Regional Archival Department internship. Only two other people were interviewed. Those other two did not have any archival experience previously.

Guess who got the internship because he saw an opportunity and took it?

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Ming
That's why it's important to have a good mix in your portfolio... It's ok to take a lot of risk as long as it isn't all your money. Diversification is key to a good long term earnings plan

If you hedge everything you will get a smaller return because you have lessened your exposure to risk.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Odin
Good post Smiley. I think the problem with our schools is that we too many regulations on how teachers can and can't teach. I also think the way schools treat students makes them feel inferior (in my school teachers can drink beverages in a classroom with carpet and we can't). Also, I think science classes should be made more fun.

Hehe. I got fired from a summer school teaching job because one of the students complained that I was drinking coffee. I didn't think it was fair.

[Soul Survivor]

What people have been ignoring so far is genetics......

If you are born with the right genes you will succeed no matter what, some people no matter what will never be able to become lawyers, bankers etc because they simply lack the mental capacity. The higher up you start the less intelligence you need to succeed. Luck of the draw...........

Also about private vs public education, the local/state governments control the funding level for each school. But property taxes still pay for the majority of the education costs. More property value = more money for school, this essentially creates a private public school system. Property taxes add up to as much as $20-25k per year, making it impossible for many people to move to the district, also out of town tution is $10-15k per year. What other districts do is to pool resources with other schools (usually forced to by local governments) and instead of having one good school and three poor schools you end up with four slightly less poor schools. Money is always the issue, the state government can't possibly make up the difference if one school district can afford to spend $16-17k per year per student because of property taxes and another spends $6-7k per year per student.

[monkspider]

Originally posted by David Floyd


We've had this discussion before, and you know quite well that my position is that forcing someone to do what is right is wrong.

Hey Dave! Long time no see.

I agree with you that someone shouldn't be forced to do anything, but that doesn't change that giving to those in need is the right thing to do, surely you don't disagree.

I think that the people who are saying "well gee, that's life. Get over it" have sold themselves short. There is no need for any of these injustices that so many here just accept as a fact of life if we only learn to work together. It doesn't require all of us to be a Jesus or Buddha, it just requires that we all just have a basic desire to live for the betterment of all. Fortunately, this day is not far off.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Japher
I am sure if that you all have a good idea it wouldn't be hard to find backers, also there are many no down buisness loans, starting at $50,000, that are out there. You just have to look...

The Small Business Administration offers unsecured loans up to $200,000. They do have several hoops you have to jump through like you have to let their analysists review your business plan (meaning you have to have a business plan), you have to have budget, list of competetors & their prices, and a bunch of other stuff but if you have a good plan there is a low interest government backed loan out there for you.