What do we think of PTW now?

[zulu9812]

btw, no one's answered my question on map exploration - will we be able to set how much of the map is explored by each country, and which civs have already been contacted? Pretty crucial for scenarios, if you ask me...

[Traelin]

Originally posted by Calc II
One thing I agree w/ coracle in his complaints is the bugs. Game makers in general are relying more and more in patching rather than releasing a polished game. Most of the time its minor and its more of a nuisance issue rather than a need to "call up a crusade against gamemakers who don't catch bugs" issue. I mean, they are humans too, and they let things slide, but they shouldnt make a habit relying on patching.

I somewhat agree with you, but somewhat disagree. Let me explain.

I agree with your assessment of gamemakers in general, in that they are relying more heavily on patches to "perfect" a product. However, I think most of them do this due to several reasons.

First, it is becoming more and more difficult to develop a quality game. Given the vast array of hardware on the market now, it becomes harder and harder to develop a game that is compatible with 99.9% of video cards, etc., so they gear the game toward the hardware product with the highest market share. Also, there is an awful lot more development, design, and test time that must go into a software product in today's market, versus the cheesy games like "Time Bandits", "Adventureland", etc. games of yesteryear (although some of them had awesome replayability).

Second, it is extremely hard to test a product in-house for the same types of bugs that could otherwise be caught by consumers. This is one reason I was surprised that Firaxis didn't offer a select group of consumers to beta test Civ 3 prior to its release. Some companies are so small and have such a rigid timescale that they can't afford to go through a rigorous beta test cycle. Still, Firaxis is certainly a reputable company, and one would think that they would have made time for a true beta test.

Third, the overwhelming majority of companies are not attempting to take advantage of the consumer as many would claim. However, I will admit that those few companies that do so really create a black mark for the honest ones. For instance, I was appalled with the bugs that existed in Pool of Radiance 2. Some of them (notably the installer/uninstaller) caused irreparable damage to people's systems. The bugs that exist in Civ 3 are trivial compared to those in PoR. I could go on and on about how peeved I was with UbiSoft, but it'll get a bit OT. I can GUARANTEE that Firaxis did the best job they could with the lifecycle timeline set by Infogrames, so we have to at least give them credit for not releasing another PoR.

[WarpStorm]

Originally posted by Traelin
This is one reason I was surprised that Firaxis didn't offer a select group of consumers to beta test Civ 3 prior to its release. Some companies are so small and have such a rigid timescale that they can't afford to go through a rigorous beta test cycle. Still, Firaxis is certainly a reputable company, and one would think that they would have made time for a true beta test.

Firaxis falls into the category of a very small company that had to work to a rigid time scale by the publisher. In addition, (the rumor goes that) most of the original team that was working on Civ3 up and quit to form their own company and the remnants had to meet the original schedule.

FWIW, they are having a beta-test for PTW.

[Traelin]

Originally posted by WarpStorm
In addition, (the rumor goes that) most of the original team that was working on Civ3 up and quit to form their own company and the remnants had to meet the original schedule.

FWIW, they are having a beta-test for PTW.

Hrm, I must have missed all this info.

[Gangerolf]

it's all good

[rflagg]

Are you telling me someone was actually dumb enough to buy a Prima strategy guide? Jesus. I thought it was common knowledge that Prima almost *always* rehashes whatever is in the book that comes with the game. In fact, sometimes they don't even re-hash. Mafia's strat guide that I browsed at the store had word for word a whole section in it from the game book.

If you're stupid enough, you deserve to get ripped off. How else do you think Prima is able to put out the guides *before* the game comes out???

[asleepathewheel]

and yet he brings it up nearly every post!

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Coracle
Wow. I didn't know that. Jeez. Firaxis continues the rip-off and sinks to levels that surprises even me.

But they don´t surprise ME. What I hear about the 30$ patch is EXACTLY what I have learned to expect from Firaxis. Shoddy work, much promised, little delivered, buggy, ... WELCOME TO SIDWORLD!!!!!

[The Pioneer]

I was wondering about all you guys that are nothing but complainers (I am not talking about the ones that do iit every so often but about the ones that are constantly doing it), how are you in your life? Do you go around and complain about everything that you see? Are you also so critical of yourself and your work as you are of others? Do you ever see anything positively before going on to b**c about that? Did you ever find anything perfect in life? (If you did you should count yourselves as lucky). Last but not least don't you have something better to do than to sit around and b**c about Civ 3 and its makers all the time, over and over again?

So long...

PS: I never had one single crash or problem with Civ 3 and I'll be buying PTW when it comes out here in Germany. It may not be perfect but I still like the game.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune


But they don´t surprise ME. What I hear about the 30$ patch is EXACTLY what I have learned to expect from Firaxis. Shoddy work, much promised, little delivered, buggy, ... WELCOME TO SIDWORLD!!!!!

Dredging up Coracle posts to slag something?

Man, you do need help.

[Traelin]

Originally posted by notyoueither
Dredging up Coracle posts to slag something?

Man, you do need help.

Haha nye, I bet Coracle is busy playing CivIII/PTW 24/7. But only because he "hates" it. Yeah right. Funny how some of the ppl that complain the most are the ones who play it the most.

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by notyoueither
Dredging up Coracle posts to slag something?

Man, you do need help.

Are you always so fast in judging people?

Fact is, I did a search for the PTW thread with the most replies, read through it, and agreed the most with Coracle (though I am even still less impressed with CivIII the original). I will not buy PTW, before it is down to $5, and perhaps not even then. To charge anything at all for a patch is an effrontery (though it is exactly what I expected from Firaxis). Still no real editor, MP not quite working, few new features, I mean: what is NOT bad about this? Enlighten me, o wise one!

[Theseus]

How anybody can call this a patch is beyond me...

[vmxa1]

I do not see how anyone with that stance can beenlighten about it. It would seems you are locked in and that is fine. I am not even saying your are wrong, only that taking that stance means you are making the juding for us.

[MosesPresley]

I will not buy PTW, as I am tired of being jerked around by Firaxis. Judging by the bug thread and many people on the forum, PTW doesn't work as advertised. If you want to buy it now and wait for it to be patched, more power to you, but for me $30.00 is a bit steep for a few new civs and the privilege of being a beta tester.

I will wait for the inevitable combo bonus package "Civ III: Shaft the World" or whatever they are going to call it a year from now. By that time the bugs will be squashed and the game should run nice and smooth.

In the meantime I will play 1.29f.