Civ III, Don't Buy If SP only

[aebbeka]

I could care less about real time multiplayer. I only ask for PBEM.

[Wiglaf]

Some of you MP'ers are talking as if civ3 won't have any MP at all. That's not true! You might have to wait a few months after the game is released in order to have MP, but you will have it no matter what. Furthermore, Firaxis has said that they are planning to make MP really good. I realize that you all are very dissapointed because you thought you would have MP right out of the box. But isn't it better to wait a few months and get a really cool MP instead of getting a half-baked MP right out of the box?

always the diplomat

If it costs more money to get MP, then it's ridiculous and firaxis is out of their minds. I buy one game, not 1/2 a game for my $60. If it is a download, the whole thing reeks of laziness and urge for money, as it's obvious there's a holiday production schedule to be met. As for your question, I'd rather a delay to make sure the one civ3 game I buy is the only one I buy.

God forbid that game programmers try to make a living! What do you think they are, philanthropists?

Some do it at the gamer's expense, and out of pure ignorance for what's right for the game itself..

a) what's up with the limited edition? +$20
b) no initial multiplayer mode, possible cost to upgrade
c) maybe even an expansion pack, $30

Obviously they have to make money, but I won't unload $100 or so on civ3 just to get it up to snuff. Release one game, it's best for all parties. EA has killed its Sims franchise by releasing $150 worth of merchandise for it. From the looks of things now, Firaxis is doing the same. No way will civ3 last if the current information is correct - the community would be too divided, too angry, and some may be disappointed with the game itself when it ships.

It's happened before...

[DarkCloud]

I'm not going to play MP... so sorry, can't help you with your boycot

[ColdWizard]

i've played civ2 for two years, sp (and scenarios) kept me interested for 1, mp kept me interested for the second

i'm not going to buy half a game and then buy the other half later, i'd rather they released a whole game. if they release civ3 the way they did with civ2, i'll find something else to play

[Provost Harrison]

I have generally found MP civ games per se to be a bit impractical as a rule. So PBEM will be a useful addition, but for the time being I am not especially concerned about the issue...

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Wiglaf


EA has killed its Sims franchise by releasing $150 worth of merchandise for it.

Really? I have not heard that the Sims franchise is dead. Could you explain?

LOTM

[lockstep]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
EA has killed its Sims franchise by releasing $150 worth of merchandise for it.

Really? I thought they are working on the third expansion pack right now ...

edit: Sorry LOTM, didn´t see your post.

[OzzyKP]

I suggest everyone check the other thread on this topic, the one with the poll. There Markus has posted a screen shot from the menu screen in Civ3. There is NO OPTION for Multiplayer!

Many of you are posting here saying you don't care about Multiplayer on the net just as long as you have your PBEM or Hotseat. Well there will be NO MULTIPLAYER AT ALL. No PBEM, no Hotseat, no LAN, nothing. If you want any of that you'll have to wait till May to pay another $30 with the rest of us.

This affects everyone. This shouldn't be a debate over which is better, SP or MP, this is a discussion about being terribly wronged by Firaxis. All MPers or potential MPers should feel wronged by this. They are putting half a game on the market and then charging you AGAIN for the other half.

Join the Boycott. Tell Firaxis we won't take this lying down. Tell Firaxis to make MP a FULL part of the game or we'll walk.

[Felch]

Um Ozzy, feel free. But frankly I'd rather have just SP now than MP and SP in five months. Thirty bucks isn't that much.

[OzzyKP]

Viva La Revolution!

Alright all you irate Civ Fans. Time to channel your anger and try to avert this tragedy. I found a few ways to ease everyone in contacting Firaxis and giving them a piece of your mind. Send lots of e-mails, and persuade all your friends who feel the same about Multiplayer to write lots of e-mails. Tell Firaxis that we are pissed, tell them we won't buy two half-games. Tell them we want MP integrated into the game and sold upfront with the rest of it.

E-Mail Dan Magaha

E-Mail Kelley Gilmore Communications Manager

and E-Mail Ask The Civ Team

If people know of other e-mail addresses to use to contact Firaxis please let us know.

Also be sure to refer them to some hot threads on the topic, with lots of people who are hot under the collar about this issue. http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=26096

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...threadid=26117

Now! MPers, let your fingers do the talking. Give Firaxis a piece of your mind.

[Wiglaf]

Really? I have not heard that the Sims franchise is dead. Could you explain?

Really? I thought they are working on the third expansion pack right now ...

edit: Sorry LOTM, didn´t see your post.

Don't worry about it lockstep, great minds think alike.

Actually yeah they are working on a third. And a Simsville. And a Sims Online. And a Sims 2. While the existing expansions have sold well, there's only so much money people have. Total up all the sims games out there, and you go upwards of $250. With all these games and so many similarities between them, The Sims naturally has a very fickle community, mostly consisting of people with either House Party or LL, or just the original, or a combination of two. By the end of next year, people will be so tired of the sims, it'll probably go away. The online communities are slowly fading off, and people have gotten over the initial novelty. That's a shame to me, because of the sheer potential of the genre.

Now, if there was only one Sims game, and we were waiting for a sequel with MAJOR gameplay innovations, then the series might have five or six years left in it. As things stand, EA really is shooting itself in the foot from every perspective but one: the quick money. IMO they would've made more with a long term franchise, but what can you do.

That's when I draw comparisons to the LE and the multiplayer edition. 3 different versions of civ3 might be released. And the TBS fanbase isn't big enough to make each one a success. So I personally think firaxis is taking the wrong route. but then again, what do I know?

[Ralf]

Originally posted by Pembleton
MP puts me into a bad mood. I want to play games for fun, not to get agitated. I've played Age of Empires, Age of Kings, and Diablo2 multiplayer and I always get pissed off because kids or *******s are either disconnecting after losing or things such as constanly pausing the game. When they're winning, they start trash talking with you. In Diablo2 you have to deal with selfish kids who try to steal what you have or try to PK you (which means kill your character) in a game that's meant to be a team game vs. the computer.

Good points!

I have said it before and I say it again: Im not against multiplayer as an added feature, and I dont think Pempleton is either. I just think you MP-lovers should put things into proper perspective. Playing MP with a turnbased complicated several hour game like Civ-3 is not like playing MP with a game like "Half-life" or "Porsche challenge" - or even realtime strategy-games like "Starcraft" and the likes. It does to a very high degree stand and fall with the maturity and forbearing discipline of the participants who plays it. And the immature tone of some rant-replies, reveals exactly a kind of player-mentality I wouldnt want to waste time on playing against in a MP-sessions. Especially not in a turnbased patiently developing & diplomacy-interactive game like Civ-3.
Also, there are problems with time-syncronizing all players to certain compromised playing-hours and session-lenghts, and so on. Some people have to work for a living - and increasingly more people faces an increasingly lacking commodity: lots of free regular leisure-time to kill off. Add to that potentially weak server-/internet reliability and/or contenders with slow modems and so on. By comparison SP have something that MP can never hope to match: easy accessibility and time-flexible game-sessions, both in terms of when and how long to play.

Like I said; they can add MP - thats fine by me. But if they are FORCED (its not necessarily that they want to do it, you know) to postpone the MP-feature, to be added with the expected future expansion-pack instead - all in order to have time to develop/playtest something even better/more stable. Then so be it.

Originally posted by markusf
your living in the past. Besides the majority of people playing those games play MP. But your probably way to old to realize that. Who do you think buys the majority of the games?

You talk like Firaxis never gonna add MP. What gave you that idea? All they maybe is forced to do is delaying the MP-feature and add it together with lots of other cool stuff in a future reduced price Civ-3 expansion-pack. You do not doubth that they plan to add an expansion-pack do you?

[lockstep]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
Now, if there was only one Sims game, and we were waiting for a sequel with MAJOR gameplay innovations, then the series might have five or six years left in it. As things stand, EA really is shooting itself in the foot from every perspective but one: the quick money. IMO they would've made more with a long term franchise, but what can you do.

That's when I draw comparisons to the LE and the multiplayer edition. 3 different versions of civ3 might be released. And the TBS fanbase isn't big enough to make each one a success. So I personally think firaxis is taking the wrong route. but then again, what do I know?

You may be right regarding the Sims after all, Wiglaf. However, I´d be glad if Firaxis ever was in a position to kill Civ3 that way: by actually selling a game and two expansion packs for about $100 to millions of customers.

I don´t view Civ3´s Limited edition as a different version, it´s rather the original game plus some goodies. If MP really is delayed, I expect (perhaps I´m naive in this respect) Firaxis to release it as a free upgrade three or four months after the single-player version of Civ3, together with a possible feature to play with 12 or 16 civs in a game. An expansion pack would have to include all this plus additional Civs and refined gameplay.

[Ted Striker]

Does anyone actually learn these games by jumping directly into MP?

Or do you play against the computer for a while and learn the game?

I don't think anyone will be jumping into MP games the first couple of months the game is out. Everyone has to learn it first against the AI. Then play MP.

If Firaxis offers it as a free download, who cares?

If they CHARGE for the mp addition, then that's a completely different story altogether.

[Ralf]

Originally posted by derek
If they CHARGE for the mp addition, then that's a completely different story altogether.

They obviously not going to charge the MP-feature alone. Instead it will be added in a Crossfire-style reduced price expansion-pack.