Sparta-Angels relations

[wuy3]

Its no fair that the gaians and the morgans are allied... WTF that should be impossible RP wise. If they can be broken up I don't think we even need Yang.

[Maniac]

Damn.


Dear Colonel,

The Commerce Ops looks positive on the proposed technology exchange, and hopes that despite the year 2170 has been passed, a deal is still possible. However, the Ops does not wish to come back on the Secret Project agreement. The more so since we have already desist from constructing the Citizens' Defense Force ourself when the opportunity came. How would the Federation have felt if suddenly, almost without warning, we unilaterally decided to cease that agreement? No, this is simply the second part of the same agreement, and we insist that it be honored by the Federation.

Regards,
IT GeoModder

[Maniac]

Do we still want to agree on a Cyberethics<->Neural Grafting deal without removal of the AV clause included, given that:
a) we might get Neural Grafting through the PDL
b) if that doesn't work, we might still get it for free if Lal gives the tech for Zak

[Snoddasmannen]

Originally posted by Maniac
Do we still want to agree on a Cyberethics<->Neural Grafting deal without removal of the AV clause included, given that:
a) we might get Neural Grafting through the PDL
b) if that doesn't work, we might still get it for free if Lal gives the tech for Zak

Personally, I don't think that deal is profitable for us, or in fact, gives us any benifits at all (correct me if I'm wrong). Instead, I suggest we offer to trade them Cyberethics for the rights to the AV.

[Maniac]

Sounds good to me.
Though could the fact that they didn't give a counterproposal indicate they have AV plans themselves?

[Modo44]

It is worth trying, as that might confirm your suspicion, Maniac. If they disagree, we can always (correctly) say that it was though of as a joint deal, and call it off as a whole.

[Snoddasmannen]

Originally posted by Maniac
Sounds good to me.
Though could the fact that they didn't give a counterproposal indicate they have AV plans themselves?

Good point ...It's also possible that they're just trying to stop us from building it, thinking it will be too good for us.

But like Modo says there's no harm in asking I guess, they already know we want to build it.

What's the next project for us if we miss out on the AV, the Cyborg Factory? (= instant elite units )

[Maniac]

WTF??

I compared the University energy reserves of MY 2169 and MY 2170.

MY 2169 they had 77 credits in reserve, and were producing 13c per year.

This year they have 63c in reserve. And they didn't hurry any production as far as I can see.

It doesn't fit the theory exactly (2c difference, perhaps explainable by the UoP changing energy allocations or so?), but a possible explanation could be that the Angels sold Adaptive Doctrine to the University for 25c. Perhaps the Angels thought we'd get the tech soon anyway from the PKs, and therefore sold it to UoP for 25c before we could give it to them.

This would mean they could have already broken the no-trade clause with the UoP in the past.

I don't want to jump to incorrect conclusions though, so does anyone else have an idea how the UoP energy reserves can be explained?

[Googlie]

Hmm - I wonder if there's a way we can get the University to build the AV, then extort the base from Zak?

If we gave him Plan Econ, and he started the AV project, what would happen if we sent a crawler there and:

• disbanded it
• turned it over to his control - would he use it to rush the SP

[Maniac]

Originally posted by Googlie
Hmm - I wonder if there's a way we can get the University to build the AV, then extort the base from Zak?

I've been thinking that as well. We'd still live by the letter of the agreement.

[vishniac]

About Ascetic Virtues:
I really don't think we should press to get it. Sure, it would be useful but not at the expense of our loyalty.
Remember the Angels could have given the CDF to Morgan if they wanted to, but didn't and sticked to the agreement.
The Angels don't have that many SP and I can't see them giving us AV's rights when they have planned for a long time to build it. To insist would seem insulting.
And don't forget we have a few other SP which will require resources: Planetary Datalinks, Cyborg Factory, Hunter-Seeker Algorithm.

That's my position on the issue.

[Modo44]

Originally posted by Maniac
I don't want to jump to incorrect conclusions though, so does anyone else have an idea how the UoP energy reserves can be explained?

We can hint to it in our next conference and/or embassy statement. Sound a bit angered, maybe?

As to our integrity or whatever, we will need to get the Angels to their knees sooner or later. Remember thay are growing, and will soon present more of a threat than Morgan...

[Googlie]

Originally posted by Maniac
WTF??
It doesn't fit the theory exactly (2c difference, perhaps explainable by the UoP changing energy allocations or so?), but a possible explanation could be that the Angels sold Adaptive Doctrine to the University for 25c. Perhaps the Angels thought we'd get the tech soon anyway from the PKs, and therefore sold it to UoP for 25c before we could give it to them.

I'd say that's a strong probability.

The PK's got it in 2169, after we played our turn. If the PK's had then given it to Zak, we'd have opened the 2170 turn with Zak offering us both Cyberethics and Adaptive Doctrine. But as Zak didn't have AD when his turn closed, only Cyberethics was sent to us at the end of the Uni 2170 turn.

However, Angels bought/traded(?) for AD from the PK's then sold it to Zak on their turn (just before Morgan, then us, in turn order)

That meant that after we closed the Uni diplo box on our turn, then called up Zak again, he could send us AD then, as the game engine then recognized that he had another tech we lacked

So I'd move my initial comment from "strong probability" to "almost 100% certain"

I say the gloves are off with the Angels. Let's proceed to voice our displeasure at them and in effect say, "All deals are off the table"

[Modo44]

Which explains their weird behaviour in the conference, when we mentioned deals with Zak. Hehe, looks like we caught them with the hand in the pie, so to speak.

[Googlie]

Hmm - another possibility, though, is that the Angels linked an AA and got Adapt Doc, then traded it to the PK's for Neural grafting.

At that point, the PK's would pass it on to the Uni, so that's why we didn't see it upon opening the turn.

I still think Maniac hit the nail on the head, though.

the A's sold it to the Uni, and traded it to the PK's for NG (and inadvertently left both in our diplobox while seeing if we had either, a good indication that we've not been probed by them)

I'm in favour of going ahead and confronting them, and using it as the pretext for pulling out of the AV prohibition, as well