Ancient Empires #2

[Peaster]

Assyria: The army performed well again, defeating a Ram and a BInf (barely saving Tikrit IMO). Still, one barb ram can attack a walled city next turn at 2/3 strength, with some chance to succeed. IIRC 3280 is an oedo year, so the Assyrians revolted this turn.

Egypt: Last turn we saw 10 barb units in the desert, but this turn we saw 14. Our armies defeated 2 Rams and 2 Binf. Some Egyptians were heavily wounded, but all units survived. We also revolted this year.

[SlowThinker]

Persians:
A Batt. Ram killed. Easy.
Greeks:
Sparta holds

I don't understand why the Hittite horde dissapeared. In 3330 all died and only 2 barbs survived.
Also the Persian horde acts strangely. Only few units are approaching to Persia, the main group marches in serried formation south.
I noticed the center is usually 40-80 units, and if 8 units around hold a serried formation no unit is released from the center. But if any square besides the center is free a unit goes out from the center.

[RobRoy]

Originally posted by SlowThinker
IMO Minoans have a good access to huts. They can choose Greece, Anatolia, Libya. In the beginning they can't choose all three simultaneously...

Yeah, I did sorta try all three at once. But I'm skeptical their access could be described as "good", unless you're just comparing them to the Greeks (in which case I'd agree). Judging by the number of Egyptian units I've seen, I think the Egyptians have proven that they can effectively check any major forays into the Libyan hutfest, by going there in strength first (though it's probably cost him his share of the Levantine huts). Ditto, I suspect if the Greeks had beelined for those huts in Attica and Euboea, I'd've been shut out of most of the Greek huts except, perhaps, for one or two coastal ones, depending on luck (remember Greeks got off to a bit of a slow start before we settled on you playing them). Anatolia would probably have been the Minoans safest bet, but I left them for last since they were the one area where the Hittites and Minoans had a conflict of interest. I figured if I waited, it would become apparent who could/should exploit that area.

Originally posted by SlowThinker
I don't understand why the Hittite horde dissapeared. In 3330 all died and only 2 barbs survived.
Also the Persian horde acts strangely...

Mayb that's a pattern. Mine started to act strangely and didn't seem to be spreading "right" for about three turns before they vanished (only 1 still hanging around, now). Hordes do disappear in SP games, though I've never figured out why...they seem to vanish quicker in more remote areas.

Originally posted by Peaster
IIRC 3280 is an oedo year, so the Assyrians revolted this turn.

Doh! Hittite High Priest flagellates himself repeatedly. Minoan First Sea Lord initiates his own revolt continuing the wave of revolutions started by his continental counterparts.

Minoans: Pop a hut for a merc. Continue dithering about whether to defend Macedonia or abandon it...Gut tells Minos he should be focusing on trade, trade, trade not on resisting an undiluted horde three tiles away.

Hittites: Popped a hut for Horseback Riding. Shared it (though this is seeming a one-way street so far). Finds the Babs and discovers that Assyria forgot to add them to the intelligence sharing network, so remedied that. Hope you're okay with your new, improved F6 screen view Platy; it should help against the barbs if it's not too late. Visits a defenseless Abydos and wonders if all the Egyptians are off fighting barbs? Seems we have heard of frequent pirates who target such vulnerable cities near coasts. Delivers a formal invitation to the Pharoahs of Egypt and Assyria to share maps, while he's there...maybe can be our Civ2Dip test? Include Minos too?

Too bad about Pal. Maybe he'll be able to rejoin us once he gets settled. Meanwhile, Peaster joining the "double" team seems a good way to continue the test; Assyria/Egypt shouldn't have any more awkward conflicts of interest than Minoans/Hittites.

You're up Plat!

[Addled Platypus]

for what eveer reason the game wont load and the CD wont even boot

might have to reinstall

will do after work (about 2am PST)

[Addled Platypus]

one more city razed to the ground, the last two to fall shortly

it's been fun to watch the barbs pass up another countries city to chase me down....I must smell nice

http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php?file=22570_ha_b3280.hot

[Peaster]

Some minor experiments... 1) I hit Ctrl-N for Assyria, saved, hit Enter, and played Egypt (not using the Assyrian save). If this causes no trouble, it will save a little time later. 2) I gave away all Egyptian tech to Minos and traded maps using the F3 screen. 3) I will prep a civ2dip file for the Hittites, with a map trade, for example.

Assyria: Monarchy, 2 barbarians slain, danger level moderate. The Hittites refuse Assy techs (with F3).

Egypt: Monarchy, 1 barb slain (out of 14) - it is hard to say if we are reducing the horde fast enough - probably so. Five techs given to Minos, plus map trade, before a hut gives us Synch.Rowing. Some plans are made for vans to Minos. BTW - What is that Hittite horseman doing on our crocodile?

Sorry for the delay - didn't notice the Bab post.

Platypus - When you lose a city in MP, it can mess up production in your other cities (not sure about hotseat mode though). You may need to fix that with civ2dip next turn.

[Peaster]

RobRoy - I just sent you a barter by email. Egypt to Hittites. Let me know if you have any problems with it.

[SlowThinker]

Persians:
Greeks: Sparta holds, but 2 BatRams around...

[RobRoy]

Originally posted by Peaster
...The Hittites refuse Assy techs (with F3).

I'll change the attitude next turn to "worshipful". See if that makes any difference. But are you sure they have something to give?

Originally posted by Peaster
...a hut gives us Synch. Rowing.

Great! the exact same tech the Minoans just got this turn.

Originally posted by Peaster
..BTW - What is that Hittite horseman doing on our crocodile?

Just passing through...Can't get around the barb on the river (horse isn't a vet...odds don't look good). I promise I won't poach any 'gators. Of course, it would be easier to just take the undefended city...

Originally posted by Peaster
RobRoy - I just sent you a barter by email...

Didn't get it. You sure you're sending it to robroy3@hotmail.com? And what exactly am I supposed to do with whatever it is whenever it comes?

Minoans: popped two huts for a merc and a tech (Sync Rowing) We're wasting goody huts if we don't share immediately, assuming we're still sharing...

Hittites: Popped a hut for merc. Finally built a second city. I'm still convinced one's luck with huts is better when you only have one on map. Found the Persians; all civs now know someone who knows someone...

You're up Plat!

[Peaster]

Originally posted by RobRoy

I'll change the attitude next turn to "worshipful". See if that makes any difference. But are you sure they have something to give?

No. In fact, I doubt it.

Of course, it would be easier to just take the undefended city...

Your choice. But it is just size one, so you would only raze it.

Didn't get it. You sure you're sending it to robroy3@hotmail.com? And what exactly am I supposed to do with whatever it is whenever it comes?

I used the Poly email, so I don't know where it went. Just sent it again, to your posted address, with some instructions about getting civ2dip, etc.

We're wasting goody huts if we don't share immediately, assuming we're still sharing...

I guess we are sharing, probably more than Kull expected. IMO we have more techs than we really need. I have several in this game that I don't have as Persia in Game #1 (at 2540BC)! If we ever play a "real" game #2, maybe we should have some informal agreement about whether we are cooperating or competing, and whether to use the F3 screen.

[SlowThinker]

I will have bad internet access next days, so feel free to sub me.

[Addled Platypus]

down to 2

bought what fodder I could

http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php?file=22570_ha_b3270.hot

[Peaster]

Assyria + Egypt: Both are holding out OK vs barbs. Each civ has 1-2 Ladder Towers and 1-2 city walls, a few skirmishers, etc.

Tried to give away all tech; Hittites accepted S.Row. I guess ST or RobRoy is up next.

[RobRoy]

Originally posted by Peaster
...I guess ST or RobRoy is up next.

24+ hours and his comment leads me to play for ST. Peaster, I didn't muck about with the barter since your e:mail implied you may need to do a new one? Have you been tempted to do anything diplomatically that we could not accomplish with the F3 screen so far?

Persians: Popped two huts: cash, cash. Persia's horde looks to be vanishing, too. 2 Rams, 3 B.I. to the east; 3 more B.I to the west might be from another (Assyria's horde?) Few questionable actions, sing out if they bother you: I elected not to rush buy many more units, since Persia looks okay, but I took the liberty of buying a Spearmen in one vulnerable city (cost 75, though). You also elected not to challenge the pretty white Chariot that was aiming at a nearby barb Warrior (and blocking you).

Greeks: Rush bought what they could. Killed one Ram, but Sparta still looks vulnerable. Sparta's entrenched defender elected to stand/heal rather than attack the nearby B.I in the forest. Realized in a miraculous flash of inspiration that an exploring horse might be blocked by a recuperating Minoans unit and requested his relocation...which the Minoans agreed to, assuming the Greeks really want to go that way...despite the fact that few goody huts remain in that direction and are already targetted.

Maps: ST, even if you didn't want to trade techs, do you want mapmaking and to trade maps? Peaster, is it okay if Hittites trade maps with the Assyrians? I know you wanted to try Civ2Dip with the Egyptian/Hittite trade. Platy, interested in map trades?

Minoans: Captured a slave and popped three huts: gold, 2 techs (H.Arch, Civil Service). Decided that a barbarian controlled Macedonia would be a great trade partner and entered negotiations with the barbs to hand over the city after a granary was finished. The Mycenaean ambassador concurred that they would prefer a barbarian city in northern Hellas to a Minoan one.

Hittites: Captured 2 slaves and popped two huts: barb, tech (fishing). Shared techs. Peaster, I think I forgot to share techs with Egypt, when I was playing Minoans...didn't want to redo the Hittites once I'd remembered. See if they'll trade one for fishing and give you the other on a threat, just using the F3 screen. If not, make your relations worshipful, as will I, and see if that changes things.

Yes, we have lots of tech. Wonder if Kull's following this game... It surely works well to share goody hut advances. Lots of single-minded humans all over the map targetting every goody hut in the first few hundred years and sharing the techs is probably not what he had in mind. My initial thought was that the barbs are the primary enemy, rather than each other. But even the early builders seem to be handling them okay...and I gather not everyone is restricting themselves to highly defensible terrain as ST and I are doing. 'Course the techs helped, I suspect...witness the Babs problems, partially due to being left out of the tech loop, I think. But whether we'd all want to share techs in a "real" game is an open question. And would we have as much luck with huts?

We could just eliminate goody huts? Or severely restrict them (eg., only poppable within a city radius). That would certainly make the "edge" civs much more desirable, I think. Minoans would be all advantage, then, I think. Greeks, too, to a lesser extent. Persians still have some issues. Maybe give invention to the Minoans instead and screw the graphics for some trade balance. 'Course I'd hate to play a trade-neutered Minoans. And removing goody huts would make the game much loooooooonger, I suspect...maybe making some kind of jump-starting .net session more attractive.

[Addled Platypus]

Still hanging in, can I pull of the defense ?

stay tuned

same PBEM
same Thread

http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php?file=22570_ha_b3260.hot