The Dance of Civilizations [Diplo Game] [Organization Thread Pt1]

[Inca (DoC)]

i do not really understand rule change for me so I do not vote yes or no.

[Robert]

Vote update:
Yes: Rome
No: Egypt, Korea, Arabia, Natives, Britannia
Abstain: Persia, India, Inca

Yes: 1 (6,66% of all, 11% of votes)

No: 5 (40% of all, 55% of votes)

Abstain: 3 (20% of all, 33% of votes)

This means that the rule-change proposal can get at most 7 'yes' votes out of 12 (3 abstain), which equals 58%.
This means that the suggestion fails to get the required 66% of the votes.

Rasputin, can you please elaborate why you voted 'no'?
Is it because of the way I depicted your suggestion? Or perhaps something else?

[Orb (DoC)]

is the war over? can we go back to the regular timer again?

[Korea (DoC)]

Rasputin, can you please elaborate why you voted 'no'?
Is it because of the way I depicted your suggestion? Or perhaps something else?

Whislt my persona lsuggeastion would not have got Ozzys support, what ypu osted ws not what i wanted.

You see if someone wants to manipulate themseves to a lower score to enable free trading each sessn then that person is not herefor the right reasons , i wanted to see if anyone would try to find the loopholes so i could take notice of the type of people here.

If thry would do somethign so obvious imagine what they doing that is less obvious in loop hole finding and mnaipulation

Ir scares me to think that a GAME has become so important to some that even thinking of making sure they werent in top 5 at the era change that shows what kind of player they are

So no I didnt support a rule that became harder to manage , i know Robert is quite capable of checking who was i ntop 5 etc etc bu he shouldnt have to it would hav ebeen so easy to do it as an instantaneous snapshot.

Also, I never called for a vote on the iss, it was very obvious that no one would support a way of preventing the top 5 civs from gainng Free Techs.

I would prefer a rule chnge that says the top 5 civs must give freely all techs frm the 2 Era lower to all other Civs.

but i dont cal lfor vote o nthat either

It wouldnt matter if i suggested lets give every player a million dolalrs in real life some civs wold still vote no becasue i raised the issue.

[Persia (DoC)]

If it's true that Byzantium, India, Korea and England are now helping the Egyptians, then I call for a pause of the game because that really is unrealistic AND very unfair.

[India (DoC)]

This free trade rule was made to help lessen the distance between the top and lower civs and it does so, but it doesn't make wonders..
I still think we should give away free vouchers to get better result, a more balanced game. I've thought of a system which is objective since based only on ingame score. In short in every month we give points to every civ and when they have enough they can "buy" a voucher from it. These points are proportional with the relative difference from the top score (details below). The only question how much would one voucher cost, how many do we give away/month. (IMO calculating for the first 6 months it should be 0->4 vouchers/per civ so far)




I write how I would calculate, I strongly suggest you skip this part :

1, actual score= ingame score+ X*remaining vouchers
Every tech worths some points, those who have more vouchers left relatively have bigger potential score. an ancient tech worths 6 points, a classical 12, a medieval 18 and so on. X is the point worth of the not yet free tech category, currently it would be renaissance and 24 points/vouchers.

2. Substract each score from the highest actual score, these are the relative scores (the no1 civ has 0, the smaller civs have more, and the bigger the difference is the more points they will get)

3, Divide 100 points proportional to those scores, and round them.

4, I think one voucher should cost 20-25 points, something like that

[India (DoC)]

If it's true that Byzantium, India, Korea and England are now helping the Egyptians, then I call for a pause of the game because that really is unrealistic AND very unfair.

My ships enroute were damaged in a storm so they went for repair to a Mali city...

So no I did not actually intervne for the reasons we've talked about..

But, on the other hand Inca's attack was quite unrealistic.. they know how many allies/friends Egypt has yet they didnt try to get better position in diplo

[Byzantium (DoC)]

Persia,

Really haven't you been playing long enough to treat with a huge shipload of salt the stories of the Koreans?

yes the Koreans have just said:

With english , Byzantium and Indian Soldiers rushing to aid the Egpytian on th eground The largest navy in the world is poised to set sail and break the Blockade.

drama comes easiliy to our Korean friends. But please, to make some statement about wanting pauses on the basis of this is foolish. People role-play stories - and some role-play rather creatively (are we to take as gospel that the Korean navy is the most powerful in the world?). I would be rather suprised if this statement of the Koreans turns out to be true.

And to be honest, surely if its true that "Byzantium, India, Korea and England are now helping the Egyptians" then what should happen is everyone gives 7's to Egypt for diplomacy next voting time for that would be a massive almost unbelievable diplomatic coup wouldn't it? Getting Byzantium and India (never mind the others) all wanting to support you?

I'm not sure where this ooc critique of in game events takes us. How can any of the nations 'accused' respond without revealing much they don't want to reveal, or at least without undermining all their storying and diplomacy?

[Byzantium (DoC)]

India - I think that something like the system you are suggesting regarding vouchers would be right.

I think we should learn from BtP where we brought in a one-off gift of voltans, and the current calls for vouchers, that there is need for them. But I would very much argue that this should be a clear system from the beginning not a sticking plaster brought in half way through as a fix. So I like your proposal for creating an actual system.

We would need to ensure it wasn't too complicated to follow (the need to compensate for current voucher spend is a pain since it is a complication. but I think you rae right that we need to do this, though its worth pondering whether we do).

Although I think that the best would be such a system agreed from the beginning I would go for implementing somethign now, but a system like yours rather than a one-off arbitrary fix, would be much preferable.

[India (DoC)]

I guess it's similar to those voltans except this system could work continously from month to month. It might seem complicated but the calculation easily can be done in excel for example. What is good in it is that it's objective and helps those more who need it more, doesnt require a special strategy (like skipping techs to get them voucher-free later), doesnt change the relative order just lessen the difference a bit. But I agree that these kind of things better discussed in the begining.

[Byzantium (DoC)]

Yes. Its good - or at least the best we have come up with - let's do it.

[Russia (DoC)]

well, as a minor nation I have to say that it is serious flaw in this game that there have formed 3-4 large blocs which have existed all game. that the large powers have in effect put their flag on other nations and consider any attack upon them to be attack on themselves. It makes playing a minor nation absolutely pointless. minor nations can do nothing to change their position, as they can't challenge the big nations (shown in the 5 small vs england war, russia vs persia), and they can't fight amongst themselves for land. so we're just tagging along for the ride, but have no hope of making any changes.

[Korea (DoC)]

what th peruvians did wrong was attack a nation that has thee strong groups

India is reltated to Egypt throuh Taoism so will help

England and Korea are related to egpyt through long negotiations of freinsdshp

Byzantium too shares a border with gpyt so is close

So the kudos goto egyptfor protecting it self agisnt larger iv attacking.

but i do nto see the reason for this war except that perhaps the Incans are getting bored.

A war over tourists being attacked ???

[OzzyKP]

The reason is they want more land and had a neighbor that has neglected its military all game. Seems like a perfectly good reason for a war to me.

I do agree that they should have done more (any?) diplomacy to avoid the current situation. Russia's point is well made though.

[Korea (DoC)]

ozzy if that god reason for war.. then i gues rome beter wathc out for indian ivasion


dont be silly, in DIPLO attacking eweak foes is bad...