Beyond the Pit [Pitboss Diplomacy Game] [Organization Thread VI]

[St Jon]

I am perplexed by the voting. How can any Civ get Military Votes when it was not involved in any War at all during June?

[Pitboss Greece]

Involved in war in June: Rome, Sparta, Japan, Russia, Portugal, Khmer
Only Metalheads got 2 vote points while not being in war. But perhaps they did some behind the scenes stuf.

[St Jon]

I have sent 2 emails to toni past 2 days, no response.
I suggest that we look for a sub as long as Toni is not playing. Portugal is too important in the end game to let the civ be unmanaged.

It would suck if Portugal would miss the victory only b/c he can't play.

Since it's impossible to find someone from outside the game, apparently, I suggest that someone from the Meduian continent will sub Portugal, as long as Toni doesn't show up. Best not one of the big civs, like Khmer or Metalheads.

Maybe Maya, America, HRE or Celts

Anybody opposes Jeroen playing Khmer and a friend of him playing Spain?

I do object to Jeroen swapping Civs. To do that is like me saying I don't like Russia so I'll take a bigger baby instead. If his friend can handle them then fine but Civ swapping is a total no no as far as I am concerned.

As for Portugal:~ HRE are a total blackball, America cannot be relied upon to play their own Turns and Celts are Vassels. Spain is not exactly master of its' own destiny either and Maya has an entirely Roman provided Army sitting right next door to Portuguese Cities. England would be wholly wrong and are also Vassels. End of Meduian minor powers.

Greece, Rome and Japan are hardly disinterested parties and both Russia and Wyandot are far too close for comfort to enough military hardware to flatten the pair of us. The only genuinely disinterested party in the Game are Vikings but they are just too disinterested to be relied upon.

If Toni cannot play then I suggest we just agree to award the Game to Rome and call it a day.

[Robert]

I do object to Jeroen swapping Civs. To do that is like me saying I don't like Russia so I'll take a bigger baby instead.

That's not fair towards Jeroen.
He's handling Spain fine and with pleasure. We are just in the situation where the Khmer are in a difficult situation. Jeroen now has knowledge about btp and he knows how to play civ. Bjorn can then play the Spanish.

Perhaps America will play every turn if his moves are very important. He's been reliable throughout the entire game. Right now I can very well understand that it's becoming a bit tedious work for backwards civs to play every turn.

[St Jon]

I'm sorry Robert but my comment implies no judgment of Jeroen's merit as either a player or a person simply that I regard Civ swapping as totally wrong. I wouldn't swap Russia for Rome regardless of experience of the game or BtP as I just regard it as bad practice and setting a dangerous precedent.

A further point is that Warning2u has repeatedly said that his inability to play consistently was due to work and R/L and nothing to do with disinterest regardless of the score.

[Pitboss Spain]

I'm sorry Robert but my comment implies no judgment of Jeroen's merit as either a player or a person simply that I regard Civ swapping as totally wrong. I wouldn't swap Russia for Rome regardless of experience of the game or BtP as I just regard it as bad practice and setting a dangerous precedent.

A further point is that Warning2u has repeatedly said that his inability to play consistently was due to work and R/L and nothing to do with disinterest regardless of the score.

I am not offended by the comment, to start with (nor easily offended by any comment, for that matter). I also agree with the dangerous precedent viewpoint, however, Spain and me do not have the type of history that counts for everyone else. I would not have suggested this if I had been playing Spain since the beginning of time.

[Robert]

I see your point, Jon, but like Jeroen said, he's not been Spain for that long, and we're in the end-game and I prefer 1 civ 1 player above 1 civ-switch.

We also have the Portugal Problem.
I understand that no solution will be perfect!
But I fear that Toni won't return. To be honest, Toni has left most games about which he had the feeling that he was not going to win, near the end.


I suggest the following:
1. Jeroen takes Khmer
2. Bjorn takes Spain
3. Japan subs for Portugal

My reason for Japan subbing for Portugal are:
- Japan is a good player
- Japan is not really involved with Portugal or any of Portugal's competitors

Important
- Japan and Portugal may not help each other or fight each others when any of them gets involved in any way as long as the subbing endures.

I understand there are many problems, but please only object here if you really do not want this to happen. If you object you are also obligated to offer an alternative.

When the new turn starts and nobody objected the new situation will start.
Please all cooperate, but raise your voice if I'm making really wrong decisions.

Robert

[Pitboss Japan]

Civ swapping is not good, but since Jeroen got Spain not a long time ago i see nothing worng giving him a "more significant" civ.

However..:

I dont think we can keep BtP alive any longer.. I mean what is the point? what else we would like to see ingame? I will do it if others want to continue the game.. I also had some ingame plans but so many players are absent it will cause problems

[Pitboss America]

Well if you are going to use my name use it right - WarningU2

I have no interest in playing another civ regardless of my ability to play every turn.

I have no issue with the suggestion by Robert.

I'm sorry Robert but my comment implies no judgment of Jeroen's merit as either a player or a person simply that I regard Civ swapping as totally wrong. I wouldn't swap Russia for Rome regardless of experience of the game or BtP as I just regard it as bad practice and setting a dangerous precedent.

A further point is that Warning2u has repeatedly said that his inability to play consistently was due to work and R/L and nothing to do with disinterest regardless of the score.

[Robert]

@Japan: We came that far, playing over a year, let's now finish it. There are a couple of serious contenders for the win, let's make this end satisfying for all. Not to mention, if we won't finish this game, who can be sure we'll end the next one?

Not to mention that some very interesting things still may be about to happen.
Do you want to play Portugal, Japan?

@America: thanks. And also thanks for sticking to the game despite your not so good position in it!

[Pitboss Japan]

Do you want to play Portugal, Japan?

I'm afraid these kind of subbings wont give us "good results". I'd certanly be interested to see if Portugal could "win" this game and how, so if others agree on continueing the game like this I'll take Portugal.
few of the prioblems i see: If a war happens on our continent again it's possible that both Japan and Portugal will be involved somehow. While i would try to be as independent as i could be making decisions a war between Japan and Portugal is unthinkable and it wouldnt be if this wasnt the case.

[OzzyKP]

Yea, we have to finish. And I don't think it is a good idea for Japan to take Portugal.

[Robert]

Then who takes Portugal?


As far as I know Japan and Portugal have no ties. No relations, no alliances, no hate.
Japan is no contender for the win, they're not neighbours. I may miss something, but I don't see troubles there.

Unless there's of course already a secret alliance between Japan/Portugal, well, then I'd say that Japan should just continue that. I'm sure he'll be honest.

[Robert]

8 hours to suggest an alternative, if no alternative is presented then Japan wil sub for Portugal.

[OzzyKP]

How about Wyndot? They may share a border, but they are less involved in international affairs than Japan is.