The HOTW VII - Setup Thread II (or the entrance of new mods)

[Robert]

1st session: 73 turns
2nd session: 59 turns
3rd session: 36 turns
4th session: 65 turns

so: good session! (2nd place on the evah-list)

The less subs we have btw the sooner we start. Most of the time we only start later because subs have to be arranged. Thus try to keep your sub-needs as low as possible and just show up in time yourself

[Toni]

Tx CS

[LzPrst]

good work CS.


glad I got here in time. IMO best session so far

[Robert]

Yup, I founded christianity 8)
Happy with that. I had the intention to found both judaism and christianity but that was too much.

First 2 great persons were for me, good for me 8)

[LzPrst]

he was slightly undiplomatic though. very I should say

[Colonel_Treize]

I apologize for him on that. Like I told others, he's a hardline Ladderite. He is rough around the edges because he is used to kill-or-be-killed games. The game I'm hosting that he is in now is a diplo-Ladder hybrid, a game style I've been pioneering. If he subs again, I'll definitely tell him to dial it down a lot. I certainly don't want to return to my Civ after being gone for four weeks with many people angry at me.

[condor223]

I definetly NEED a sub for Egypt on the 6th. I will be away then. Egypt is poor, squished and resourcless... Maybe some wonderful player can give me a leg up on this situation while keeping her allies happy too!???

I'd like to be able to stay in the game till the end!

Nolz.

[Robert]

Originally posted by Colonel_Treize
Quit patting yourself on the back, Cyber.

Somebody must do it
And so far my call for leaving the number of subs as low as possible

You're going to be away for ONE MONTH? wow!
I hope you'll have a good time in Thailand! Don't get murdered :P
I'm sure that The Netherlands are safer then both Thailand AND the USA :P

Too bad you'll have to skip a session Nolz
Please line up a good sub! I share only borders with Egypt, a good sub is VERY important to me! (Or I'll have to kill Egypt) (j/k)

[OzzyKP]

Ok, lets all vote on the victory conditions set down in the following post.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?postid=4600586#post4600586

This has been tweaked to death, I think it is time to just go ahead and vote. The above point system will determine the ultimate winner for HOTW7. Yea or nay.

OzzyKP - Yes
CyberShy - Yes

[LzPrst]

important matter. subs. we really need to coach subs a little better. Englands sub went off the handle and declared war on carthage with no warning or justification. that's bad diplo. it seems there was a certain lack of adjustment to the diplostyle in that particular case. Now this isnt the end of the world, hell, it isnt even the end of carthage, but it does illustrate some important questions.

how independent do we want our subs to be? can the real player be held responsible for the actions of his sub? how well do subs have to know and respect diplogame style of play?

we should flesh this out ASAP as a lot of people are going away and subs have to rounded up. we should try to aim for a number of reliable and diplo-experienced subs. if not... well then much of the point of diplogames stand in peril.

[Robert]

In addition to LzPrst: do we teach our subs about TORaCTT?

And: we we ourselves not forget about TORaCTT?

[Toni]

Looks like TORaCTT was forgotten last session, which gave 2 players a huge advantage. I think it was very unfair to the rest of us. I think u guys rushed it too much and the penalty which was given was just too little. We even don’t know what tech the player in question decided not to trade when he gets it. We should resolve this ASAP before next session.

Do not forget that they are 2 players here; one who traded it when he should had not and in exchange acquired many other techs which he did not had prior to this and the 2nd which was given the chance now to trade himself with the rest of us and not making the effort to go for Alphabet.

I think the 1st player research time was cut roughly around 70 turns maybe more not sure on the 2nd, but I hope u see my point.

Of course I’m very grateful that deity tried to make up for this mistake with a fair offer, but not sure why the rest didn’t hear it or just rushed the moment and continued with their game.

[Robert]

Something different, will MMC play next friday? I think he never said that he wouldn't play this friday btw.
As far as I know everybody will play next friday, right?
The week after we'll only miss Nolan.

And of course I may be missing every week because of my wife going to deliver my first born who'll reign in my name later after I died. Hmmm, played too much civ I guess.

Anyway, as always: If I don't show up in time just start without me (with a sub or something). One of my allies should tell my sub what to do. My allies know who are my allies

[LzPrst]

aye. Toractt must be kept.

it was especially bad that it was alphabet that was traded off since this allowed the receiver to trade more techs. seriously, it isnt very difficult to keep track of this, and it is very important that we do. trading techs isnt something that we should be doing all willy-nilly. that is why we put in the Toractt rule to start with.

a correction might be forced to ensure that the benefit of the illegal trade does not outweigh the punishment.

for example. the receiver should not be able to gain the benefit of the illegally gotten tech. this benefit should instead be moved to another tech of similar cost. in this case the receiver should not be allowed to trade techs with people without alphabet until he discovers... for example literature.

deity's punishment should be to be whipped 100 lashes by 10 giant gorillas. seriously though, let's not slip up again. or I'll have to fetch the gorillas. Deity's punishment should have been something like no tech trading, giving or receiving, for the next 50 (or so) turns.

unfortunately this is too late to implement. but we can put in these rules for next session. Such harsh punishments will

A) Make people try harder to avoid slipping up, and
B) Punish them properly if they do.

We assumed that everyone would be able to keep the rule, as this seems to not be the case, even with a monumental development tech such as alphabet, then we need to adopt sanctions that will deter messing up and making people more careful about tech trading.

The suggestions for punishment I consider fair and doable. We are all playing by a code of honor here. If you mess up, fess up and take your punishment like a grownup. Or better yet. DONT MESS UP!

[Toni]

Why is it too late to implement?

Also thanks Deity for having the balls to report your mistake, sad that the receiver had none or at least very small to tell us who he is. (don't take it personal )

Again a punishment is not late, I say the payment for such an act be no tech trading, giving or receiving equal to the amount which both players won by having this illegal deal.

This should be fair to the rest of us.

The suggestions for punishment I consider fair and doable. We are all playing by a code of honor here. If you mess up, fess up and take your punishment like a grownup.