Console Wars IV

[El_Cid]

One good thing to come out of what Vista is really about(the start of PC 'lockdown' for small devs - bare with me, time will tell i promise!), and the downturn in interest from the mainstream AAA PC game producers is that I've started to try out a few of the Linux/unix distro's that are around.

I think it really must be the first period in the PC's history where 'non-geeks' can use and try out pretty decent and stable alternatives to MS.
I know it's a bit of a cliche and a long running joke, but probably the real future for the PC will lie in this direction. That will leave the big three with their console monopolies of mostly fairly stale, but profitable, gaming.

@Lordshiva, nice diagram - it made me chuckle

[DrSpike]

Not sure how Vista is a console wars issue.

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles
I'm not sure why you consider it a big gamble when all it does is supplement what was already available on the GBA, while the Wii itself is a paradigm shift.

You don't see the wii as a refinement of the DS philosophy?

Underpowered tech with a new (to gaming) potentially more accessible control scheme + wider variety of games that aim for a wider audience?

Its not as risky once the strategy has already proven successful.

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles


Yes, but the thing is you can make 100% acceptable "status quo" mobile games on the DS without using the touchscreen or the 2nd display in any extensive manner. This is why it is NOT a big gamble, if no one wanted to use the new features it wouldn't kill the platform or the device, it can still function as a "status quo" mobile gaming platform.

The Wii is completely different. The hardware and control scheme of the Wii means it cannot compete vis-a-vis with Xbox 360/PS3 "status quo" games and it forces games to take a new paradigm, which is why it is a far larger gamble.

Brawl and Mario Kart-both extremely traditional games that allow for (and I'd recommend) traditional controls. No one is forced to use motion sensing on those games and a number of other ones out there.

[DrSpike]

Originally posted by asleepathewheel


You don't see the wii as a refinement of the DS philosophy?

Underpowered tech with a new (to gaming) potentially more accessible control scheme + wider variety of games that aim for a wider audience?

Its not as risky once the strategy has already proven successful.

Indeed - but I don't think our snugglesome friend wants to admit anything of the sort.

[Wiglaf]

Originally posted by Nikolai


You must have a funny computer.

Jesus misinformed you on this one

http://askbobrankin.com/disable_vista_uac.html

But shutting off UAC will cause Windows to occasionally produce popups warning you that UAC is not enabled, and will prompt you to go to the Security Center to turn it back on. You can disable this secondary warning in the Security Center.

Here's another option that allows users to

[Asher]

Once I disable UAC (and it's the first thing I do), I've never heard anything about it again on my computer. You, and Bob Rankin, are clearly retarded.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
First of all you cannot disable UAC and pretend like nothing has changed. Doing so triggers regular security alert popups that act like all hell is about to break loose every 5 minutes. You know, the popups that also tell you whether windows update or your antivirus is working. You need to then disable ALL of those security alerts in order to get this to go away. This is bad design, no way around it.

It is trivial to disable UAC and never hear a single word about it again on your computer. I don't know why you find this difficult, but there are options clearly visible to do this.

Second, it will be a cold day in hell when I write only to my isolated directory, but even if I let Microsoft annoy me into organizing my files this way, that's not the only thing that triggers UAC, and you know it. You can't even install or remove applications without a prompt. Do you have any idea how big a pain in the ass that is?

No, because that's how it is on MacOS X and Linux as well. That's really the way it should be by default, for security reasons. It's actually a bit more annoying on OS X and Linux as you need to type in your admin password every time you install/uninstall something.

[Asher]

Originally posted by asleepathewheel


You don't see the wii as a refinement of the DS philosophy?

Underpowered tech with a new (to gaming) potentially more accessible control scheme + wider variety of games that aim for a wider audience?

Its not as risky once the strategy has already proven successful.

It doesn't matter if it's a refinement. I don't see the DS as having motion controls and I don't see it as being "underpowered" for a portable gaming console because, at the time, it was the fastest one ever made.

The Wii on the other hand, is an order of magnitude slower than its competition with quirky motion controls which are nowhere near as precise as the DS' touchscreen and instead of adding additional screen realestate like on the DS, the Wii kept it the same while their competitors added more.

The Wii is a "refinement" of the DS only insofar as they are trying something different. But you have not at all addressed my point of this: the DS wasn't nearly as big a risk because all of the new "risky" features were not essential to the use of the device. Whereas on the Wii, they basically are.

And don't you get me started on the Super Smash Brothers type bull****. That's exactly the kind of **** the industry doesn't need, that game is exactly the same as the one from the Gamecube and you know it. "Traditional" videogames have ceased to evolve on the Wii and the Wii simply cannot compete on that front with the 360/PS3, whereas the DS can hold its own in portable games that compete with the PSP.

Have I mention that every single control scheme for the Wii is terrible? The Wiimote used as a Wiimote is imprecise and twichy, the Wiimote used as a controller is just uncomfortable and weird, the Classic Controller just flat-out sucks in every way possible, and the Gamecube controller sucks even more.

The DS was a smaller risk because the new features supplement, the Wii is a bigger risk because the new features replace. QED.

[Asher]

Originally posted by DrSpike


Indeed - but I don't think our snugglesome friend wants to admit anything of the sort.

Why would I admit that the Wii is a refinement of the DS' motion controls and philosophy of being an order of magnitude less powerful than its competition, when that is not the case?

[Apocalypse]

Plus PDAs have had touch screen games for a while...

And even though the PSP is pretty much more powerful than the DS, the DS's cartridges are the future and it has over twice the battery life. Plus it actually fits in my pocket.

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles

It doesn't matter if it's a refinement. I don't see the DS as having motion controls and I don't see it as being "underpowered" for a portable gaming console because, at the time, it was the fastest one ever made.

Yes, it was the fastest portable for all three weeks. Of course, its pretty obvious with the quick revision (just look at the ds phat-yikes) that they rushed it out early to preempt the PSP.

The Wii is a "refinement" of the DS only insofar as they are trying something different. But you have not at all addressed my point of this: the DS wasn't nearly as big a risk because all of the new "risky" features were not essential to the use of the device. Whereas on the Wii, they basically are.

You think N had more to lose (ie risk) by rolling the dice on a 20m install base than an 80m install base? What did Nintendo have to lose, really, with the Wii? They certainly weren't going to lose significantly more marketshare than they had already shed-Mario and friends can maintain them a 15-20m console base easily, and considering they don't sell consoles at a loss, there really wasn't that much risk. Plus, they already had a plan in place that they started with the DS that obviously worked very well. The success of the wii is directly attributable to knowledge gained from the risk taken on the DS.

And don't you get me started on the Super Smash Brothers type bull****. That's exactly the kind of **** the industry doesn't need, that game is exactly the same as the one from the Gamecube and you know it. "Traditional" videogames have ceased to evolve on the Wii and the Wii simply cannot compete on that front with the 360/PS3, whereas the DS can hold its own in portable games that compete with the PSP.

??? You're the one who brought up "status quo" games. And, the results of the past few NPD's have proven that Nintendo can compete with the other two consoles' traditional games.

[Apocalypse]

DS has many traditional games that are very successful though.

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by Apocalypse
DS has many traditional games that are very successful though.

And?

[CrONoS]

Originally posted by Mr Snuggles
the DS wasn't nearly as big a risk because all of the new "risky" features were not essential to the use of the device. Whereas on the Wii, they basically are.

The point of Asher is "quoted" and he is right!

Even if the Wii concept seems to have root in the DS concept. Teh DS wasn't at all risky. Hardware wise it was significantly more powerful than the GBA, so if the second screen failed to be adopted by player, you could, at least, make new games on a new platform which is more powerful than the GBA.

While on the Wii, if teh controller failed to be adopted by player, Wii would have his ass kick by MS and Sony. Because, he would have been really hard to innovate on a underpowered console. On the Wii, Nintendo put all their eggs on the controller.