IDP Rules Amendment

[-Jrabbit]

Well, the first thing is to fix the bad Bapay and get it right. But even if the Bapay is inaccurate I would think that a Bapay is a Bapay, and the same rule would apply.

But it's not my call.

[EPW]

Yeah, I'm not making a ruling on this unless it comes up.

[Ben Kenobi]

I would appreciate any future commentary not being framed as personal criticisms. Thanks.

Fair enough. My bad. I don't think the templating is very good on this at present. That's my personal opinion.

[Sparrowhawk]

As the noob (or is it newb? I'm too old to remember the difference) here I would like to offer my 2 cents....

I think we use "BAPAY" for 2 different meanings. I think of a "BAPAY" as the player picked when the time alloted for a pick has expired (in our case 4 hours) without the person offering any insight into their choice. I would think anyone "BAPAYed" in this instance should have the option of switching the player out within a reasonable amount of time.

The other meaning is when a person sends in a list or a PM to another person explaining their desire (which can be any of a number of things: a list with clearly defined players, a desire for a specific position, BAPAY me a WR, or even just "BAPAY me"). In my opinion a person who sends in a PM any instructions (as specific or vague as they might be) forfits their right to replace the player chosen, even if their instructions were to be BAPAY'ed.

That's my opinion, take it for what it's worth

/me

[Ben Kenobi]

Sparrow, my good man, I have argued for that, but as it stands, you can swtich picks, change players, do lots of other things, but only if it's a bapay. You cannot change off a list pick. Bapays have superpowers they can do anything.

[ColdWizard]

The bapay switching is so that we don't have to try to force players to be online regardless of personal circumstance. Also allows us to keep the draft moving at a reasonable pace. Should never be changed. "Oh hi, you had a tsunami? Well, Carson Palmer was the best available, enjoy!"

I'm on the fence with the issue I raised. Since the pick already happened, I'll use it as an example. Sloww asked for a specific player, and if that player was taken, to bapay him with that same position. The player was taken, so I sorted by fantasy points in that position. Since I've got everyone's rosters in a spreadsheet, I knew which players at that position he already had. My question came up when the first three players had the same bye weeks as the players he already had. Now, I was figuring that this pick would be a backup and so would have given him the fourth listed player. But at the time I didn't know if he wanted best available or best with bye considered. Someone not so mellow as Sloww could, theoretically, have a conniption either way I went. Thus the question.

(Sloww was on and -Jrabbit had a little trouble with his windows, so I explained my reasoning and we went with a list).

[-Jrabbit]

Since I'm now just another manager, let me spout on this topic a bit.

The draft procedures we use have evolved over the past decade (roughly), and are intended to keep the draft moving forward smoothly. Back in the day, BAPAY time limit was 24 hours, with weekends off. The draft could easily take a month, and typically started before NFL training camps even opened.

We evolved into two leagues with different rules, both of which are effective. While our league's current rules ensure a dead minimum of only 3 picks a day, we've been rolling through roughly two rounds on most days. The draft will likely take under two weeks. I think it's fair to say that's a positive thing. This is not to say that our rules and procedures are perfect. Far from it. The rules evolve a bit every year. That should continue.

Sparrow: "BAPAY" is short for Best Available Player At Yahoo. The term is used loosely, but that's the actual meaning.

The importance of Bye Week compatibility varies with the position involved. For starters, it's basically meaningless. (I should note that some get twitchy if their top two RBs or WRs share a bye; not I). For top reserves, especially QB2, having byes different from starters is pretty important. For end-of-benchers, I rarely even consider it.

Bapay victims are allowed to change because (it is assumed), the manager has RL issues (work, living in Europe, etc) that prevent him from drafting in a timely fashion. People who leave lists, OTOH, are assumed to know what they are doing in the choices they make.

There is no requirement to leave lists. So if you leave a list but didn't consider factors that, upon your return, make you remorseful, well that's on you -- for submitting a list you couldn't live with.

My advice: If you're not comfortable with the possible outcome of instructions/list/etc., it's better to let the Bapay happen, thus giving you options. If you're "holding the bag" for a list someone else sent you by PM, I suggest following the PM to the letter. It was nice that CW was able to reach Sloww and get an answer, but that's not always possible.

[-Jrabbit]

Fair enough. My bad. I don't think the templating is very good on this at present. That's my personal opinion.

It's easily possible to edit or evaluate a document without judging the character or capabilities of its originator.

[SlowwHand]

I wish they would go back to the whole division being off the same week. As far as fantasy, it made it a lot easier. I just ignore Bye weeks until I'm forced to deal with it.
I'm trying to cut down on my stress levels.

[ColdWizard]

Yeah, I had to look up the bye weeks. Too bad I had already drafted 2 starting RBs with the same bye and 2 starting LBs with the same bye. The yahoo and espn resources I've been using don't have the byes listed for some reason (or I haven't found it).

One of the main reasons I don't leave lists is that people tend to take my players and as for instructions, sometimes I can barely follow my own thought processes, let alone put them in words coherent enough for someone else to follow.

[-Jrabbit]

Not displaying Bye info is a huge weakness of Yahoo, especially considering its depth of data and willingness to upgrade other areas. I'd much rather have byes listed rather than, say, knowing what team they play next week. In reaction, I import Byes to a master list in Excel, pre-draft, putting that number in the same cell as the player's name so it migrates through my various workbook pages.

[Ben Kenobi]

It's easily possible to edit or evaluate a document without judging the character or capabilities of its originator.

I already said mea culpa, JR. Let it go.

[Ben Kenobi]

My advice: If you're not comfortable with the possible outcome of instructions/list/etc., it's better to let the Bapay happen, thus giving you options. If you're "holding the bag" for a list someone else sent you by PM, I suggest following the PM to the letter. It was nice that CW was able to reach Sloww and get an answer, but that's not always possible.

I disagree. This is one of the reasons why people don't leave lists. Not only are they worried about tipping people off, they know they are stuck. That's 4 hours of the draft that doesn't have to happen, because someone was courteous enough to leave a list.

[-Jrabbit]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: it's a draft, not a race.

I have no problem with people not leaving lists if they're so paranoid about "tipping someone off." Is it really that hard to leave a list with someone who's just picked, or is several picks away? If our Bapay time was 16 hours like in D/ST, your argument would make more sense.

Courtesy is nice; I'd like to see more of it around here. But it doesn't confer any special rights.

Some people have lists and strict priorities; others judge their picks in accordance with the flow of the draft. The latter should NOT leave lists, as they are basically meaningless. Again, I see no problem with that. But I see huge potential problems with people updating their draft lists and roster spreadsheets, only to come back 12 hours later and find that all that POSTED information is now wrong.

[Ben Kenobi]

I have no problem with people not leaving lists if they're so paranoid about "tipping someone off." Is it really that hard to leave a list with someone who's just picked, or is several picks away? If our Bapay time was 16 hours like in D/ST, your argument would make more sense.

They already have to do that with BAPAY. So clearly it's ok to invoncenience folks that way by not showin up.

As for tipping people off, I always have a list, just in case something happens. Geesh I could get hit by a bus, but you'd still have Jag picking for me.