AHL- Apolyton Hockey League 08/09 (III): The Home Stretch

[Ben Kenobi]

And around the same time, Vancouver got shutout by Montreal which can't win a game to save their lives recently...and Vancouver lost by a bigger margin than Calgary did vs Tampa.

Not in the middle of our 'roll'.

This is not even mentioning the fact that the Flames have the superior record in the last 10 games played, so your assertion that the Canucks are on a roll while the Flames are not is remarkably stupid.

They have exactly the same record without Loser points.

The Flame's "OT losses" were all in shootouts, which (and you may not know this, being a Canucks fan) are not events in the playoffs. On the other hand, they've won games in OT during that time, but not lost. That's a good sign.

As have the Canucks...

As for the Canucks vs the Flames, Calgary is 2-1-2 vs the Canucks this season. 2 of your wins came in the first two games of the year, which don't mean much of anything at this point

Still count.

We've beaten the Flames 4 times, and Calgary would be 1-4, and have lost the season series. You should find that cause for concern having a losing record against your greatest division rival.

The Flames have been RIDDLED by injuries right now, major ones. Todd Bertuzzi just had surgery and is out for at least a month, Daymond Langkow has a hand injury and has not been playing,

Neither of whom are named "Iginla" or "Kippersoft".

That would be about as bad as Burrows getting injured.

Why the **** do you think the Flames have been playing with guy like Kris Chucko, Jamie Lundmark, Kyle Greentree, and Warren Peters? They're not NHL players. Many of them just played their first NHL games this week because of it.

Because they don't have the depth.

The Canucks are still in 5th which is a testimony to their true strength having been without Luongo, their best player for 6 weeks. Do the same to Iginla or Kippersoft, and Calgary would be battling Colorado.

[Ben Kenobi]

BTW, Ben, "Kippersoft" is on pace to shatter the NHL record for most wins in a season.

A 'record' set by Luongo just the season before?

Am I supposed to be impressed? Canuck fans are getting inured to having decent goaltending and winning games.

[Ben Kenobi]

But they've lost more in regulation...

You'd expect so with them being 8 points behind.

You've beaten the Flames 3 times this season, not 4. You've beaten the Flames in regulation or overtime twice. These were both the very first games of the season. The Flames have beaten you in regulation or overtime twice, and much more recently. The Canucks have won once more in a shootout, but anyone using that as an indicator for post-season play must not know the rules of hockey.

You said 2-1-2, by my count that means the flames have lost 4 times.

You obviously don't know anything about hockey or the Flames if you think injuries to Bertuzzi, Langkow, Bourque, and Giordano are not "serious" injuries.

They aren't as serious as the Canucks losing Luongo. There are only two Calgary players that I would certainly consider as important, and those are Iginla and Kippersoft.

The Flames are without 3 of their top 6 forwards and one of their top 4 d-men and have called up kids from the farm team to take their place.

Yet they still have their top line intact. That you consider them serious injuries tells me everything I need to know about how good the Flames really are? The truth, not very.

On the other hand, Luongo got injured and the Canucks dropped from a clear lead as #1 in the division to being OUT OF THE PLAYOFFS.

Yes, sir. He is the best Canuck player. I would say the only ones on the Flames who would mean as much to the Flames would be Iginla or Kippersoft. Now that he's back, they've returned to form.

It wasn't until you had to go sign Sundin (because THE CANUCKS LACKED DEPTH) and got Luongo back that you climbed back into the playoffs.

Weren't you just saying Sundin was useless to the Canucks? Which one is it Asher? First he's useless and now he's our saviour?

But you still haven't made up any ground on Calgary which, despite being riddled by SERIOUS injuries and relying on kids from the farm, is still 10 points way, way ahead of the Canucks.

Iginla scratching a pinky and missing a shift is about as significant as those injuries you've mentioned.

[Ben Kenobi]

Oh, Ben, you're so ****ing stupid.

The record was set by Brodeur, not Luongo. Brodeur had 48 wins, Luongo 47 wins.

Both of whom broke the previous record set by Parent in the same year. Again, why am I supposed to be impressed by something that's already been done, and better?

And WTF does when the record was set matter? It's still 82 possible games. Luongo sure as hell ain't going to beat his record this year. It's a huge accomplishment to break an all-time NHL record, and your attempt to belittle it (and your obvious ignorance about the record in general) is embarrassing to your fellow Canucks fans.

Getting injured for 6 weeks has something to be said about breaking the recorad again. It's not a real record because of the rules changes which make it easier to rack up wins.

Mr. Parent had neither the benefit of shootouts nor overtime 4 on 4 to contribute to his win total. His record was 47-13-12, where in today's world, he would be expected to record 56 wins.

39 wins with 18 games to go, and needs 10 wins to break the record.

It won't happen. By my reckoning he needs 16 wins in 18 to match Mr. Parent. Mr. Parent had a 0.783 win percentage, and if we extrapolate that over the 12 ties, gives us another 9 wins if he played by the rules of today.

Mr. Parent also set the record in 78 games.

So, that will give Mr. Parent another 4 games. In today's world he would have gotten 59 wins.

Parent's record is secure.

[snoopy369]

I do think Ben has a point about ties/no ties, though I wouldn't extrapolate the way he does.

How about the record for regulation wins? What's that?

[Ben Kenobi]

Parent with 47.

[Ben Kenobi]

In comparison, Brodeur had 35 wins in Regulation. Not bad, but not up to his normal standards. Luongo had 42 regulation wins, short of Parent.

[snoopy369]

Parent won 47 with no overtimes whatsoever? Interesting. I wonder how that compares in terms of (% of games won in regulation) ... ie, pre-OT were a higher percentage of games won in regulation because teams tried harder at the very end to avoid a tie - or the opposite? [There's a belief now that the opposite is true IN overtime, hence the RL point; but was that accurate at the time.]

[Ben Kenobi]

Parent won 47 with no overtimes whatsoever? Interesting. I wonder how that compares in terms of (% of games won in regulation) ... ie, pre-OT were a higher percentage of games won in regulation because teams tried harder at the very end to avoid a tie - or the opposite? [There's a belief now that the opposite is true IN overtime, hence the RL point; but was that accurate at the time.]

Yep, I checked it out. No overtimes in 1973-4.

I'm not sure about the percentage of games, you 'd have to compare the games that do not end in regulation with the ties back then.

Even so, it still wouldn't give Brodeur the record, as Luongo had more regulation wins in the same year.

[snoopy369]

Brodeur certainly has the record for most wins in a year, and Parent certainly has the record for most regulation wins in a year. Records, across sports, are not 'modified' simply because they are from an era with different rules... you simply must choose which record is the most interesting in the reference frame desired, which is what I'm considering.

In general, SOW are certainly of the least value; I'm not sure about regular OT wins, though. To win in OT, a goalie must play a bit more and work a bit harder; if they lengthened the periods to 25 minutes, would you then object if a goalie won 50 games? Probably not.

Do Luongo/Brodeur/Kipper have SOW counted as wins?

[Ben Kenobi]

Do Luongo/Brodeur/Kipper have SOW counted as wins?

Yes. Brodeur had 10 that year.

[Ben Kenobi]

So much for the 'hottest team' in the NHL.

FINAL 1 2 3 T 
Calgary Flames 0 0 1 1 
Carolina Hurricanes 3 2 1 6 

  Period 1 
  Cgy Car Time   Scoring Detail   
  0 1 14:51   Ra.Whitney 19  ( Se.Samsonov, Ro.Brind'Amour ) (pp) 
  0 2 17:40   Se.Samsonov 14   
  0 3 18:22   Er.Cole 17  ( Er.Staal, An.Babchuk )  
  Player Team Time   Penalty 
  Ol.Jokinen Cgy 14:27   Interference 
  
  Period 2 
  Cgy Car Time   Scoring Detail   
  0 4 7:58   Ra.Whitney 20  ( Er.Staal ) (pp) 
  0 5 17:17   Sc.Walker 4  ( Ma.Cullen )  
  Player Team Time   Penalty 
  Wa.Peters Cgy 1:46   Hooking 
  Ro.Regehr Cgy 6:42   Slashing 
  .Team Cgy 7:40   Too many men 
  Da.Moss Cgy 13:05   Elbowing 
  
  Period 3 
  Cgy Car Time   Scoring Detail   
  0 6 4:08   Ra.Whitney 21  ( Ma.Cullen, Ch.LaRose ) (pp) 
  1 6 16:11   Ja.Iginla 29   
  Player Team Time   Penalty 
  Er.Nystrom Cgy 2:23   Instigator 
  Er.Nystrom Cgy 2:23   Fighting 
  Er.Nystrom Cgy 2:23   Misconduct 
  De.Seidenberg Car 2:23   Fighting 
  Ti.Gleason Car 4:43   Roughing 
  Mi.Cammalleri Cgy 5:56   Stick Holding 
  Ji.Vandermeer Cgy 9:30   Elbowing 
  Ti.Conboy Car 9:30   Fighting 
  Ji.Vandermeer Cgy 9:30   Fighting 
  Ji.Vandermeer Cgy 9:30   Misconduct 
  Ti.Conboy Car 9:30   Roughing 
  De.Seidenberg Car 11:29   Tripping 
  Ch.LaRose Car 12:33   Tripping

They go down 6-0 to Carolina until Carolina gives them a pity goal. I'm really seeing it, Asher.

[snoopy369]

Ray Whitney

[Ben Kenobi]

You'd better be praying that Kippersoft doesn't get injured. He's not won a game for you yet, 0-6-1.

You would probably do better with the extra attacker all game then with your 'backup'.

[Ben Kenobi]

Don't get cocky, Ben -- your team is 10 whole points behind Calgary, but the way you talk your team is actually good.

They just beat the toughest team remaining on their schedule.

For their last 18 games, 11 are against teams already out of contention. They play 4 games against Colorado.

Calgary, on the other hand has 2 such games remaining.

Calgary is in trouble.

If the Canucks win their game in hand, they are only 6 points behind Calgary, with a game still to play in Vancouver against Calgary. They just have to make up 2 more games elsewhere.