NFL - Are you Ready For Some Football?! - Six Weeks Till Playoffs!

[snoopy369]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


Rivers has a much higher YPA.

If it's the yards that matter then Tomlinson deserves to get in. If it's the YPA or YPC, then Rivers gets in.

That neither gets to go is one of the worst decisions ever. One of the top offenses in the league and the only one who gets to go is Dielman on the OL?

The Holocaust was one of the worst decisions ever. The decision that led to the Trail of Tears was one of the worst decisions ever. Not sacking Rome (Hannibal) was one of the worst decisions ever. A pro bowl selection, in that group?

Rivers should've gotten in, sure. Don't turn it into some sort of travesty, though; that sort of melodramatics just encourages us to heap scorn on you. State the fact (Rivers was snubbed) that we'll all agree with, and move on...

[Ben Kenobi]

The Holocaust was one of the worst decisions ever. The decision that led to the Trail of Tears was one of the worst decisions ever. Not sacking Rome (Hannibal) was one of the worst decisions ever. A pro bowl selection, in that group?

True I did go overboard.

The Hochuli 'decision' was worse.

[Ben Kenobi]

You can't credit Rivers with a win either, especially since they didn't.

Had Hochuli swallowed his whistle the game was over.

That's why Rivers actually beat Cutler, but he failed to beat Cutler AND Hochuli.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
If you are going to consider Cutler vs Rivers in terms of their winning record then they are both 7-7 right now.

But not really.

[SlowwHand]

Cutler is a mouthy piece of crap. You can "not really" that as long as makes you happy, but the fact remains, he talks too much and doesn't back it up.

[Imran Siddiqui]

If it's the yards that matter then Tomlinson deserves to get in. If it's the YPA or YPC, then Rivers gets in.

Ya see we like to think a bit deeper about things and not fall into hard and fast traps. You should try it.

Ronnie Brown has, in addition to the YPC, the success of the "Wildcat" which has completely transformed the Dolphins this year.

Also our fine friends at Football Outsiders have Ronnie Brown ranked 17th in both DVAR (Defense-adjusted Yards Above Replacement) and DVOA (Defense-adjusted Value Over Average), while LT is 33rd in both ranks and actually negative in DVOA.

As for the QBs, Cutler and Rivers are very closely ranked (going to footballoutsiders, Cutler is 4th in DVAR and Rivers 6th, while Rivers is 4th in DVOA and Cutler 7th), but Cutler has one more win and is generally believed to have less talent around him (ie, he's doing it all himself).

[SlowwHand]

Bull****.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Translation: "I find facts to be bull****" - Slowwhand

[SlowwHand]

You sound like you're talking about Aaron Brooks, the poor baby, doing it all by himself. Are you saying those were facts. too? The biggest difference is that "I can throw harder than Elway" Cutler is that if he doesn't pick up the pace a little, he has no positional alternatives. If Brooks comes back, maybe he'll make a decent backup DB. Cutler has no such option. If he throws harder, who cares? I mean, other than you? To say he does it all on his own is a stupid thing to say. To insist you're correct, is worse.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Do you disagree that the general perception is that Cutler has no supporting cast?

The vast majority of NFL viewers can name the talent around Rivers. A far, far smaller number can name the talent around Cutler (and usually will stop at Marshall, and perhaps Royal, though interestingly, both have fairly unimpressive DYAR and DVOAs... and very, very few know who is actually the RB for the Broncs)

[Zopperoni]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
and very, very few know who is actually the RB for the Broncs)

From game to game, even the Broncos themselves don't know who's going to be their RB.

[SlowwHand]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Do you disagree that the general perception is that Cutler has no supporting cast?

The vast majority of NFL viewers can name the talent around Rivers. A far, far smaller number can name the talent around Cutler (and usually will stop at Marshall, and perhaps Royal, though interestingly, both have fairly unimpressive DYAR and DVOAs... and very, very few know who is actually the RB for the Broncs)

I certainly do disagree.
Let me cite you a case that shows your beloved statistics don't mean squat.
Who holds almost every passing record for the Cowboys?
Not Meredith. Not Staubach. Not Aikman. Danny White.
Are you going to sit there and tell me that Danny White, for all his amassed statistical records, is the QB face of the Cowboys? Probably, which shows how ignorant you can think. Statistics are not the by and and end all.
You like to pick a struggling QB and blame it on a lack of WR's. It's bull****. Cutler is an even better example than Brooks, and you argued Brooks until such time that he got out of football.

[snoopy369]

Struggling QB would be one thing, but Cutler is doing quite well (well enough to be picked for the pro bowl, which even if he is a borderline candidate, he still was picked). Two QB's with similar numbers, one of which has great players around him, the other of which doesn't, I'd be okay with taking the one with the poorer supporting cast, all other things aside; though unless the numbers were quite similar I wouldn't want to do that.

I'd probably take Rivers over Cutler, myself, though I think they're pretty close in my mind and both deserve to be there. Favre is the one that doesn't.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by SlowwHand
I certainly do disagree.
Let me cite you a case that shows your beloved statistics don't mean squat.
Who holds almost every passing record for the Cowboys?
Not Meredith. Not Staubach. Not Aikman. Danny White.
Are you going to sit there and tell me that Danny White, for all his amassed statistical records, is the QB face of the Cowboys? Probably, which shows how ignorant you can think. Statistics are not the by and and end all.
You like to pick a struggling QB and blame it on a lack of WR's. It's bull****. Cutler is an even better example than Brooks, and you argued Brooks until such time that he got out of football.

Do you ever really know what you are talking about?

How does Danny White compare to other Cowboys QBs in relation to the rest of the league? You know because the rules in regard to passing made it easier to complete passes? The site I've lead you too considers league averages. You know, the stuff you can't comprehend.

In addition, you also can't read. Troy Aikman holds the career passing yards record for the Cowboys, followed by Roger Staubach. In addition, Staubach has the highest QB rating of any Cowboys QB of anyone over 50 games (Romo is higher, but he's only played in 43 games... also he plays in a very pass friendly league which has to be considered). Yards per Attempt is actually held by Craig Morton and then Staubach (for over 50 games). Aikman holds the highest completion % for any Cowboys QB who has over 50 games.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/dal/career-passing.htm

What exactly does Danny White lead in? What a single season passing record for his 1983 season?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by snoopy369
I'd probably take Rivers over Cutler, myself, though I think they're pretty close in my mind and both deserve to be there. Favre is the one that doesn't.

Yeah, but with the Jets leading the AFC East, you know Favre is getting picked.

People also probably think Green Bay was stupid for getting rid of Favre, even though Rodgers has better numbers (it's the defense that is killing the Packers).