Sarah Palin: Completely bat****

[rah]

But one should take into account the circumstances (eg, economic situation) which will impact approval ratings of people who are unemployed and wondering why the president isn't magically giving them a new job.

I wasn't looking at special circumstances or anything else. I just said that they were falling. (ok maybe like a rock was a bit of an exaggerattion) but given the love fest prior, the drop is quite signification an foreshadows what will happen if things don't get better.

Now granted these numbers aren't the end all of political analysis, but I think any talk of the repugs being finished forever is a bit premature.

[chequita guevara]

I understand the context of wtf Palin was talking about. Apparently the bill before Congress requires doctors to talk with patients over the age of 65 about their end-of-life plans at a minimum of every five years, and gives Medicare reimbursement for the talk (it is the doctor's valuable time, after all). It also mandates the the doctors report to the government what sorts of plans people are making, so the government can get some kind of idea what choices people are making (no heroic measures, resuscitate, etc.).

Somehow, this has been morphed into a panel of doctors deciding for you what will happen at the end of your life. Minority Leader Boehner was the first one to start this lie.

[chequita guevara]

I wasn't looking at special circumstances or anything else. I just said that they were falling. (ok maybe like a rock was a bit of an exaggerattion) but given the love fest prior, the drop is quite signification an foreshadows what will happen if things don't get better.

Well, it doesn't tell us where the fall in the Obama love is coming from: center, center-left, or left. A lot of liberals are very disappointed, not merely in the fact that he isn't living up to their idealized expectations, but that he's reversing himself on the few actual promises he did make.

[Mon River Monarch]

Well, it doesn't tell us where the fall in the Obama love is coming from: center, center-left, or left. A lot of liberals are very disappointed, not merely in the fact that he isn't living up to their idealized expectations, but that he's reversing himself on the few actual promises he did make.

The Gates / Crowley ordeal probably didn't boost Obama's popularity numbers (among white people & police officers anyway).

What makes Palin (or anyone else) think she will be relevant 3 years from now if she isn't holding public office? She's as dead as Abe Lincoln right now

[Wezil]

I sincerely hope she runs because she is bat**** insane.

Time to let the lunatics run the asylum.

[Japher]

That's what we've been doing the last 16+ years!

[Wiglaf]

She's worried about rationing of care in the future, more elderly, more government control, need to cut costs, something has to give. The system now is more efficient and offers better incentives. And yet you cannot bring yourselves to admit this because she has big boobs. I completely agree that women should probably stick to cooking and not driving but at least admit that's why you marginalizing her.

[Guynemer]

She's worried about no such thing. She's worried about remaining a hero to her just-as-bat****-as-she-is base.


Besides, Wiggypoo, we already have rationing. It's just that the insurance companies are doing it instead of the guvmint.

[Theben]

I think the reaction of the Dems is hurting the Dems more than the extremist behavior by the repugs is hurting the repugs. Mostly because the behavior that is being accredited to the repugs is should actually be assigned to centerists (is that a word?) more so than total right wing conservatives.

Diminishing returns. The dems have a lot of space to lose ground, the repubs can't do too much more damage than they've already done.

Btw while the dems are hurting themselves the repubs aren't moving away from the "party of NO" tag. IMO in the next election the right won't gain any votes but the dems will lose a bit.

[Ben Kenobi]

Guynemer:

People understand that money rations things. That's the whole point of price. What they don't understand is that they aren't permitted to buy something that they do have the money for.

Its the difference between, "I can't afford this," to "oh I'm sorry, we are all out of stock." Oh, and you can't go to another store that might have it in stock.

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Yeah, but what you have to realize is that most people don't understand rationing when it comes to their insurance. The point of insurance (for the consumer) is to pay for the things they can't pay for. If the company denies something that the person believes they need, then what is the point of insurance? As far as they are concerned, they do have the money to pay for it...that's what their investment in health insurance is for. The fact that it's rationed when people believe they have the money to pay for it is what causes so many problems.

Now, from the consumer's perspective, there is no actual difference between the insurance company denying a claim and the government denying a claim, but the psychological and rhetorical gap between the two is what's holding up this whole process.

[Ben Kenobi]

Yeah, but what you have to realize is that most people don't understand rationing when it comes to their insurance. The point of insurance (for the consumer) is to pay for the things they can't pay for.

The point of insurance is to pay money now in the interest of averting trouble later on. It's like this. If you keep crashing your car your premiums will go up. Health insurance can't do this, so what happens is that the marginal cost is passed onto all the clients, and that way costs can hopefully be controlled.

If the company denies something that the person believes they need, then what is the point of insurance?

Insurance is only as good as you insure for, all health insurance only covers certain things. You take health insurance because you hope that it will cover whatever bad stuff may come.

As far as they are concerned, they do have the money to pay for it...that's what their investment in health insurance is for

Then you should have bought more/different coverage. With the system you have there you can buy private insurance if you want more coverage. Up here you have no choice. Everybody pays, and if it isn't covered, then you are SOL. You can't go to another insurance company.

The fact that it's rationed when people believe they have the money to pay for it is what causes so many problems.

People just don't get the idea of TANSTAAFL. Insurance only works if the premiums exceed the claims. So then my question is, why not save the money you are spending on health insurance, and use that as a rainy day fund? The reason why not, is because of economies of scale. It's cheaper for an insurer to provide care because they are dealing with a large number of people. The same thing happens with single payer, however the lack of competition is the problem. Premiums can only go so high when there are multiple providers. A monopoly is a bad idea, because there is no pressure to save money.

[Koyaanisqatsi]

People just don't get the idea of TANSTAAFL.

Yes. Exactly. But the problem is that there is no free lunch either way, but the psychology and rhetoric have been turned in such a way as to give the idea that the free lunch is being taken away by healthcare reform.

[DinoDoc]

Little fuel for the thread:

....

The 64-year-old Oregon woman, whose lung cancer had been in remission, learned the disease had returned and would likely kill her. Her last hope was a $4,000-a-month drug that her doctor prescribed for her, but the insurance company refused to pay.

What the Oregon Health Plan did agree to cover, however, were drugs for a physician-assisted death. Those drugs would cost about $50.

....

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=5517492&page=1

[-Jrabbit]

Obama's Death Panels are being test marketed in Oregon!!