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**Dinner** · May 29, 2023, 18:00

Originally posted by Ming View Post

Please provide proof for your hundreds of assets. The majority of the crowd were MAGA.
There is NO PROOF of your Hundreds of government assets.
(and just what the hell is a government asset anyway

)

The only real assets there were Trump assets... doing exactly what he told them to do.
They were there because Trump commanded they come... and then commanded them to march on the Capitol.

But I guess in Trump land, the majority of the crowd was liberal assets to make Trump look bad?

FBI admitted it in court when they were arguing to not release the video. They literally said it would expose the identities of between 100-200 agents and confidential sources. That would make them damn near the majority of people who entered the capital on Jan 6th. Just like how they made up 13 of the supposedly 17 people who threatened to kill Witmer. BTW one of the four people they roped into that FBI plot was a literal retarded person. Talk about abusing the disabled.

**Berzerker** · May 29, 2023, 18:25

Originally posted by Geronimo View Post

Actually I never conceded that they shelled "the Donbas". I think it's total BS that they were targeting the region like some sort of ww2 bomber Harris campaign. They were indeed attempting to shell and defeat the separatist armed formations.

The question "who started it?" required context. Who started what? inter Ukrainian political conflict? inter Ukrainian violence? Inter Ukrainian armed forces conflict? Russian intervention across the Ukrainian border? I maintain that for everything about the current special operation between Russia and Ukraine that Russia totally and exclusively "started it". Then you go off on some tangent about "coups" and CIA funding of sniper ops against police and protestors as if that is even remotely relevant to Russia invading Crimea in 2014 let alone 2022.

I also totally diasgree that the "violence made him flee" what a bullcrap joke Berz. How many times has Zelensky been forced to flee by Russian violence?

And did they succeed with their attempt to shell the Donbas for 8 years? Kiev did attack the Donbas with aircraft so the defenders set up anti-aircraft weapons and shot down a civilian airliner by mistake. Iran did that too after Trump murdered that general in Iraq. For me to take Kiev's side I'd have to believe their coup and assault on the east were justified and I dont believe that. This was started by a western backed coup handing right wing nationalists the keys to the kingdom. The coup started the war. The man eastern Ukraine overwhelmingly elected was toppled and the right wing killed protesters. Russia took Crimea in response to the coup. Fortunately for Crimeans they got there before Azov or the Donbas war would have had a southern front.

A Ukrainian negotiator was murdered for treason. What do you think would happen to Zelensky if he tried to end the war? They'd kill him too. Putin knows the US is in charge, Russia could have killed him long ago. But Zelensky did go on a world tour for a couple weeks after that drone attack on the Kremlin. Now you're comparing Zelensky to the guy driven from office by a massacre, the people responsible for that massacre are the bigger threat to Zelensky than Putin.

**Berzerker** · May 29, 2023, 18:50

Originally posted by Ming View Post

Please provide proof for your hundreds of assets. The majority of the crowd were MAGA.
There is NO PROOF of your Hundreds of government assets.
(and just what the hell is a government asset anyway

)

The only real assets there were Trump assets... doing exactly what he told them to do.
They were there because Trump commanded they come... and then commanded them to march on the Capitol.

But I guess in Trump land, the majority of the crowd was liberal assets to make Trump look bad?

We're not talking about the majority of MAGA, just the seditionists responsible for the 'coup'. Even the case against that one-eyed fat man admitted the riot was not part of the coup, the Oathkeepers took advantage of it. For what exactly I'm not sure, that guy didn't go inside and the riot is what caused the delay in certification.

So we have a half dozen 'seditionists' in a sea of govt assets. Who are these assets? Well, they were dressed like MAGA and Oathkeepers. According to court documents from the trials they were FBI, Capital police, Wash DC police, DoJ/Homeland Sec and Secret Service. Dont know if Tony Fauci had the FDA on hand to censor Covid information yet, but that was coming to a theater near everyone soon enough. Trump told his audience to protest peacefully, what were these govt assets telling people?

**Jon Miller** · May 29, 2023, 18:55

Half a dozen? https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/24-m...0incarceration.

Arrests made: More than 950 defendants have been arrested in nearly all 50 states and the District of Columbia. (This includes those charged in both District and Superior Court).

Criminal charges:

More than 284 defendants have been charged with assaulting, resisting, or impeding officers or employees, including approximately 99 individualswho have been charged with using a deadly or dangerous weapon or causing serious bodily injury to an officer.
- Approximately 140 police officers were assaulted January 6 at the Capitol, including about 80 from the U.S. Capitol Police and about 60 from the Metropolitan Police Department.
Approximately 11 individuals have been arrested on a series of charges that relate to assaulting a member of the media, or destroying their equipment, on January 6.
Approximately 860 defendants have been charged with entering or remaining in a restricted federal building or grounds. Of those, 91 defendants have been charged with entering a restricted area with a dangerous or deadly weapon.
Approximately 59 defendants have been charged with destruction of government property, and approximately 36 defendants have been charged with theft of government property.
More than 295 defendants have been charged with corruptly obstructing, influencing, or impeding an official proceeding, or attempting to do so.
Approximately 50 defendants have been charged with conspiracy, either: (a) conspiracy to obstruct a congressional proceeding, (b) conspiracy to obstruct law enforcement during a civil disorder, (c) conspiracy to injure an officer, (d) seditious conspiracy, or some combination of the four.

Pleas:

Approximately 484 individuals have pleaded guilty to a variety of federal charges, many of whom faced or will face incarceration at sentencing.
- Approximately 119 have pleaded guilty to felonies. Another 364 have pleaded guilty to misdemeanors.
- A total of 52 of those who have pleaded guilty to felonies have pleaded to federal charges of assaulting law enforcement officers. An additional 22 individuals have pleaded guilty to felony obstruction of law enforcement during a civil disorder. Of these 74 defendants, 41have now been sentenced to prison terms of up to 90 months.
- Four of those who have pleaded guilty to felonies have pleaded guilty to the federal charge of seditious conspiracy.

Trials:

40 individuals have been found guilty at contested trials, including 3 who were found guilty in the Superior Court of the District of Columbia. Another 10 individuals havebeen convicted following an agreed-upon set of facts. 16 of these 50 defendants were found guilty of assaulting, resisting, or impeding officers, a felony, including one who has been sentenced to 10 years in prison.

Sentencings:

Approximately 351 federal defendants have had their cases adjudicated and received sentences for their criminal activity on January 6. Approximately 192 have been sentenced to periods of incarceration. Approximately 87 defendantshave been sentenced to a period of home detention, including approximately 14 who also were sentenced to a period of incarceration.

That was the status on January 2023, there have been additional people charged recently https://www.npr.org/2023/03/25/11650...6-capitol-riot .

JM

**Berzerker** · May 29, 2023, 20:42

How many were convicted of sedition? During BLM riots thousands of people impeded cops

**Ming** · May 29, 2023, 23:20

gee.... in Trump land, unless they have been already convicted of sedition, they were just all innocent people who just happened to be breaking the law on the request of Trump... None of them did ANYTHING wrong.

I guess Trumpetes will believe whatever he tells them to believe.

**Geronimo** · May 30, 2023, 00:02

Trump is a bend the letter of the law till it breaks kinda con. Has been all his life. He didn't command them to break the law he just intentionally tried to arrange the conditions where he expected it would "spontaneously" happen and willfully refused to lift a finger to tamp it down until the resulting fireworks blazed for several hours. That was his tantrum at losing.

He did tell them they would "peacefully" proceed to the capital once in the speech but that was purely CYA and plausible deniability for him. He did not instruct the mob to be violent or start any "hang mike pence" slogans or indeed to do any specific illegal thing. The guy tried to incubate a riot on his behalf without ever ordering or commanding or even asking for one. Technically that is. That's Trump's MO. I wouldn't waste any time trying to directly implicate him for having commanded or instructed the lawbreakers. The lack of his response to stop it, however, was impeachable IMHO.

I hope we connect this side conversation to Ukraine in some way or else resume it in another thread.

**Berzerker** · May 30, 2023, 03:23

Russiagate is very much connected to Ukraine in much the same way HUAC was to the cold war

**BeBMan** · May 30, 2023, 09:40

Originally posted by Thoth View Post

Russia has been doing an amazing job of intercepting Ukrainian missiles. Almost 100%.

.

However I do have to wonder about the cost effectiveness of using oil storage facilities and ammunition depots to intercept missiles.

That is probably why they moved to hypersonic Kinzhals to intercept SAMs mid-air.

**BeBMan** · May 30, 2023, 12:57

Just came across this:

WHO records more than 1000 attacks on health care in Ukraine over the past 15 months of full-scale war

WHO records more than 1000 attacks on health care in Ukraine over the past 15 months of full-scale war

https://www.who.int/europe/news/item/30-05-2023-who-records-1-000th-attack-on-health-care-in-ukraine-over-the-past-15-months-of-full-scale-war

Kyiv, 30 May 2023WHO has verified more than 1000 attacks on health care in Ukraine since the invasion by the Russian Federation in February last year – the highest number WHO has ever recorded in any humanitarian emergency. This grim milestone yet again highlights the difficult and dangerous circumstances in which the country’s health system operates, and the challenges of providing both routine and emergency health-care services. Attacks hinder access to health care for tens of thousands of people, increasing the risks of illness and death. The 1004 WHO-verified attacks over the past 15 months of full-scale war have claimed at least 101 lives, including of health workers and patients, and injured many more. They have impacted health providers, supplies, facilities and transport, including ambulances.WHO defines an attack on health care as “any act of verbal or physical violence, obstruction or threat of violence that interferes with the availability, access and delivery of curative and/or preventive health services during emergencies”. This can range from violence with heavy weapons to psychosocial threats and intimidation that affect access to health care for those in need.“These attacks threaten the safety and well-being of health workers and undermine care for people living close to conflict areas,” said Dr Jarno Habicht, WHO Representative in Ukraine. “Attacks on health care are a violation of international humanitarian law. They deprive people of the care they need and have wide-ranging, long-term consequences.”Such attacks rob entire communities of essential health services that are needed to save lives, leading to increased illness and death and deterioration of health systems in the longer term. The psychological effect on patients scared to seek health care, and on health workers unable to provide care in safe and protected environments, are also significant, and will impact the health of the population for long periods of time. WHO continues to advocate for safe access for the delivery of health-care services, free from violence, threat or fear. This is critical to putting people in need at the centre of the collective humanitarian response. “The fact that the health system in Ukraine continues to operate amid such circumstances is a testament to the heroic dedication of health-care workers,” continued Dr Habicht. “Despite the challenges posed first by the COVID-19 pandemic and now well over a year of war, Ukraine’s health-care workers remain amazingly strong, brave and patient, day after day, saving lives and providing care to those in need. We stand in solidarity with them and all those working to ensure that everyone in Ukraine has access to the health care they need.” WHO has been monitoring and responding to health needs in the regions most affected by fighting in the east and south of the country. According to the Health Resources and Services Availability Monitoring System (HeRAMS), health facilities in the most affected areas, including Kherson, Kharkiv, Zaporizhzhia and Donetsk, have reported facing difficulties due to lack of security and to structural damage. However, a high percentage of health facilities in these regions are functional and accessible, even though they continue to operate only partially due to damage.“Even as we continue to verify attacks on health care as this relentless war grinds on, we also note that attacks on other civilian infrastructure, especially in the past 6 months, are indirectly impacting the capacity of the health system overall,” explained Dr Habicht. “WHO has so far reached almost 9 million people with support nationwide since 24 February last year. We are stepping up efforts, along with the United Nations and other partners, to access more areas, including regained parts of Ukraine where health needs are among the most acute.” According to WHO data, significant challenges have been reported in providing specialized services, such as chemotherapy and mammography, due to a lack of staff and medical equipment. Some regions also face difficulties in providing high-skilled childbirth services. Although primary health-care remains widely available in war-affected regions, health costs have been increasing in the past half-year. Surveys conducted by WHO indicate that nearly a third of the population is finding it difficult to afford certain health services.

**Thoth** · May 30, 2023, 13:03

Originally posted by BeBMan View Post

That is probably why they moved to hypersonic Kinzhals to intercept SAMs mid-air.

They seem to be doing both.

Gotta admire that Russian efficiency

**Berzerker** · May 30, 2023, 20:39

Did Lindsey Graham admit to paying bounties on Russian soldiers? Something to the effect of killing Russians being money well spent.

**Berzerker** · May 30, 2023, 21:27

Maybe not, the video was edited and he might have meant supporting Ukraine was the best money we could have spent

**BeBMan** · May 31, 2023, 02:23

Tara Reade, who accused Joe Biden of sexual assault, defects to Russia

Tara Reade, a former Senate staffer who in 2020 accused Joe Biden of sexual assault, said on Tuesday she had defected to Russia.

“I’m still kind of in a daze a bit but I feel very good,” Reade told Sputnik, a Russian press outlet supportive of President Vladimir Putin, while sitting with Maria Butina, a convicted Russian agent jailed in the US but now a member of parliament in Russia.

“I feel very surrounded by protection and safety,” Reade said.

Now 59, Reade was a staffer for Biden when he was a US senator from Delaware.

In 2020, as Biden ran for the Democratic presidential nomination, she claimed that in 1993, in a Senate corridor, he pushed her against a wall and assaulted her. Biden repeatedly denied the accusation.

At her press appearance in Russia, Reade was described as a “writer and publicist and former aide to Joe Biden”.
Sitting next to Butina, Reade said: “I just really so appreciate Maria and everyone who’s been giving me [protection] at a time when it’s been very difficult to know if I’m safe or not.

“I just didn’t want to walk home and walk into a cage or be killed, which is basically my two choices.”

Reade recently flirted with testifying before US House Republicans seeking to use committees to attack Biden and his family.

The decision to defect to Russia, she told Sputnik, “was very difficult. I’m not an impulsive person. I really take my time and sort of analyse data points.
“And from what I could see based on the cases and based on what was happening and sort of the push for them to not want me to testify, I felt that while [the 2024] election is gearing up and there’s so much at stake, I’m almost better off here and just being safe. My dream is to live in both places, but it may be that I only live in this place and that’s OK.”

Biden is running for re-election. As president, he has helped maintain international support for Ukraine as it fights invading Russian forces.

Reade said: “To my Russian brothers and sisters, I’m sorry right now that American elites are choosing to have such an aggressive stance. Just know that most American citizens do want to be friendsand hope that we can have unity again.
“I am enjoying my time in Moscow, and I feel very at home.”

Tara Reade, who accused Joe Biden of sexual assault, defects to Russia

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/may/30/tara-reade-defects-russia-biden

Former Senate staffer who made claim in 2020 appears on Russian media alongside convicted Russian agent in US Maria Butina

**Berzerker** · May 31, 2023, 02:54

Where did she say she defected? Former Biden staffer accuses him of sexual assault and leaves the country out of fear and The Guardian spins it into a defecting traitor.

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