Krexit

[I AM MOBIUS]

Ben has left the field of battle - at least he had the good grace not to even fight his total failure on this one!

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[Cort Haus]

The Iraqi government is seizing disputed areas such as oil rich Kirkuk (where I have been before) to take them away from Kurdish control. It is a blantant resource grab by the central government.

Hardly a blatant resource grab, as it wasn't Kurdish in the first place. It is predominantly Arab and Turkman, and the Kurds took it at the same time as IS took Mosul in 2014, with some evidence of collusion with IS. https://twitter.com/AlSuraEnglish/st...81899500044288

As IS were defeated in 2016/17, Kurdish groups took advantage to take further land beyond their autonomous region. Then the Iraqi central government came to take it back and the Peshmerga ran away.

Map showing their territory as accepted in the Iraq constitution (solid red line), and that which they at times controlled (dotted line).

[Cort Haus]

Syria, Iraq - Why The Kurdish Independence Project Failed

http://www.moonofalabama.org/2017/10...ject-died.html

[Dinner]

Hardly a blatant resource grab, as it wasn't Kurdish in the first place. It is predominantly Arab and Turkman, and the Kurds took it at the same time as IS took Mosul in 2014, with some evidence of collusion with IS. https://twitter.com/AlSuraEnglish/st...81899500044288

As IS were defeated in 2016/17, Kurdish groups took advantage to take further land beyond their autonomous region. Then the Iraqi central government came to take it back and the Peshmerga ran away.

Map showing their territory as accepted in the Iraq constitution (solid red line), and that which they at times controlled (dotted line).

Have you been there? I lived there for a year. I suggest you read up about the Arab ethnic cleansing and Saddam's campaign of colonizing the area with Arabs. Thus why it is a disputed area.

I would suggest reading up on the topic and then getting back to us because right now your presumption of knowing anything which I don't on this topic is, frankly, insulting. I spent a year of my life on this very topic in that place.

[Dinner]

And you're just as bad as BK. The Iraqi government has merely retaken a part of Iraq back under its control. It's not part of the Kurdish region - the best you can say about the Kurds is they were minding it after the ensuing power vacuum during the ISIS attacks that took Mosul.

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It was a disputed area that used to be majority Kurd before the Arab ethnic cleansing and colonization campaign. The whole point of that campaign in the Saddam era was to secure the oil resources in that area and to remove rebellious Kurds. You are one of the people around here who like to think he knows everything about everything but you don't. Some people actually do have first hand knowledge which you lack.

[Proteus_MST]

Well, I for my part can understand the Iraq taking back Kirkuk (and wouldn't have acted differently if I would rule Iraq)
Yes, Saddam did ethnic cleansing on Kirkuk ... but on the other hand there are internationally accepted borders for the kurdish autonomous region.
And these borders end way outside of Kirkuk.

Barzanis inclusion of Kirkuk into his Referendum seems to be an as dubious attempt of illicit land grab to me, as the ever growing jewish settlements in the Westbank are

[Dinner]

Yes, it was outside the officially recognized boundries which themselves were just the green line drawn by former President Bush in 1992 at the end of the first gulf war. I fail to see how that line is any more legitimate than the historical boundries.

Now, on the other side, I certainly understand why the Iran backed central government wants to control a region that produces a full 1/3rd of the country's oil (which is the only real export from Iraq). Their intentions are not even remotely pure though as the Irab sponsored militia has been burning Kurdish homes, beheading Kurdish fighters, and generally looting everything not nailed down. They are most certainly not the good guys here.

[I AM MOBIUS]

It was a disputed area that used to be majority Kurd before the Arab ethnic cleansing and colonization campaign. The whole point of that campaign in the Saddam era was to secure the oil resources in that area and to remove rebellious Kurds. You are one of the people around here who like to think he knows everything about everything but you don't. Some people actually do have first hand knowledge which you lack.

LOL!

"I lived there in a tent for a year, so I'm a total expert on Kirkuk!"

Hmm, so I spent a whole year travelling the world a while back - that makes me EXPERT OF THE WORLD - MUTHA****A!!!

My dick is bigger than yours by your own calculations...

Oh yeah, clue: you're not looking far enough back - basically you're letting your well documented racism towards Arabs to blind yourself to the obvious flaws of your argument.


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[Ben Kenobi]

Barzanis inclusion of Kirkuk into his Referendum seems to be an as dubious attempt of illicit land grab to me, as the ever growing jewish settlements in the Westbank are

I'll take ****ty analogies for a 1000, Alex. Are you really arguing that the Kurds have occupied Kirkuk for 3 thousand years?

[Ben Kenobi]

First off, Kirkuk is the capital of the Kurds. Don't agree with Iraq trying to take it after the services of the Kurds. Iraq needs to give something in return or face Kurdistan declaring it's own independence.

Secondly, the Palestinians were given the West Bank, but they decided to go to war with Israel to take all of the land not some of it. They lost, so Israel took it. If you don't want to lose land don't start **** you can't finish.

[Proteus_MST]

I'll take ****ty analogies for a 1000, Alex. Are you really arguing that the Kurds have occupied Kirkuk for 3 thousand years?

If we go about who was in possession of some place the last hundreds or thousand years, there should be no Israel, because Palestine was ruled by arabs for the past thousands of yeas (before the Brits took over).
If we go with who ruled a region for the past centuries maybe you should also support that all polands are thrown out of Silesia and the whole region being given back to germany (and its former inhabitants being resettled there)

Similarly you shozuld support that the Oblast Kaliningrad should be given either to the germans (who ruled it till the end of WW2, under the name of Königsberg, part of eastern prussia), or giving to the Polands, because both, germans as well as polands have more rights to this region and only the forced expulsion of germans (as well as massive settlement of russians) is the reason why there now is a russian majorit in Kaliningrad.
Similarly you should, of course, support the forced expulsion of rusians out of Kaliningrad (and resettlement of germans and polands there)

I for my part neither desire a disbandment of Israel, nor a restoration of past borders of germany (or a change of ownership of Kaliningrad) ... instead I go with the international accepted borders (which see Israel without the Westbank settlements, germany without eastern prussia or silesia, but also Kurdistan without Kirkuk )
(and btw. also see russia without Crimea)

[Dinner]

LOL!

"I lived there in a tent for a year, so I'm a total expert on Kirkuk!"

Hmm, so I spent a whole year travelling the world a while back - that makes me EXPERT OF THE WORLD - MUTHA****A!!!

My dick is bigger than yours by your own calculations...

Oh yeah, clue: you're not looking far enough back - basically you're letting your well documented racism towards Arabs to blind yourself to the obvious flaws of your argument.


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I didn't live in a tent and I spent 6 days a week going out in the city and country side speaking directly to the various factions in the city about their issues and disagreements. I know more about that place, its history, its people, and the various factions there then you ever will. Fact.

As usual Sava, you are just wrong but are to proud and ignorant to know it much less admit it. As always you remain a clueless big mouth who smokes too much and learns too little.

[Aeson]

If we go about who was in possession of some place the last hundreds or thousand years, there should be no Israel, because Palestine was ruled by arabs for the past thousands of yeas (before the Brits took over).
If we go with who ruled a region for the past centuries maybe you should also support that all polands are thrown out of Silesia and the whole region being given back to germany (and its former inhabitants being resettled there)

Similarly you shozuld support that the Oblast Kaliningrad should be given either to the germans (who ruled it till the end of WW2, under the name of Königsberg, part of eastern prussia), or giving to the Polands, because both, germans as well as polands have more rights to this region and only the forced expulsion of germans (as well as massive settlement of russians) is the reason why there now is a russian majorit in Kaliningrad.
Similarly you should, of course, support the forced expulsion of rusians out of Kaliningrad (and resettlement of germans and polands there)

I for my part neither desire a disbandment of Israel, nor a restoration of past borders of germany (or a change of ownership of Kaliningrad) ... instead I go with the international accepted borders (which see Israel without the Westbank settlements, germany without eastern prussia or silesia, but also Kurdistan without Kirkuk )
(and btw. also see russia without Crimea)

Ben should be kicked out of the Americas.

[ricketyclik]

I didn't live in a tent and I spent 6 days a week going out in the city and country side speaking directly to the various factions in the city about their issues and disagreements. I know more about that place, its history, its people, and the various factions there then you ever will. Fact.

As usual Sava, you are just wrong but are to proud and ignorant to know it much less admit it. As always you remain a clueless big mouth who smokes too much and learns too little.

I'm pretty sure that's Mobius. I could be mistaken.

[I AM MOBIUS]

I'm pretty sure that's Mobius. I could be mistaken.

MWUHAHAHAHAHA!

My work here is done!

Oerdin, you're full of **** and have clearly been brainwashed by Kurdish propaganda - just read the history books you ****ing moron!

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