nice speech

[Kidlicious]

No one punched you.

I didn't burn alive on 9-11 either. What's your point?

[Aeson]

My point is you weren't punched. It wasn't an attack on you as you claimed it was.

[Uncle Sparky]

Canadians aren't interested in talking to Nazis. I guess punching them in the face is OK. I think shooting them would be better... Seemed to work in WW2.

[Aeson]

Maybe (I'm just guessing) cockney judges him in comparison with people with very similar ideology who actually engage in violent acts. Apparently he hasn't yet or at least in apparent fashion.

Nazis in the US are generally non-violent. They're still Nazis. Just Nazis who don't have the power to implement their vision of cleansing America of anyone not of the "superior white race".

[Kidlicious]

9-11 was an attack on all of us. Why is this hard?

[Aeson]

Comparing a person getting punched to 9/11 is disgusting.

[Kidlicious]

Really?

[Aeson]

Yes. It's disgusting to diminish the victims and heroes of 9/11 by equating the whole thing to a random person punching a Nazi.

[Kidlicious]

Channeling kentonio?

[Aeson]

I would guess kentonio also thinks it's disgusting.

[Bereta_Eder]

Nazis in the US are generally non-violent. They're still Nazis. Just Nazis who don't have the power to implement their vision of cleansing America of anyone not of the "superior white race".

I think political violence is more mainstream in europe but maybe I'm wrong.
Everyday violence is more common in the US, again I might be wrong (judging from homicides etc)

The theorem that violence should only be done by the state is basically the cornerstone of democracy.

Now that holds a lot of water. Is it really a democracy?

Is it not state violence when people can't have healthcare?

etc

Then the other question is wether political violence reaches goals.

If we take into account that democratic principles such as free education/health seem to be respected more in europe than in the US and that in Europe political violence if far less guiltified then we reach the conclusion that it does reach goals

[C0ckney]

I've watched it plenty C0ckney. He's obviously a Nazi. He styles his hair in the "fashy". He glows at the response of the "sieg heil" from his audience. He doesn't speak out against it, doesn't admonish them. He blushes like a Hitler youth who got to touch the chancellor's hand when he says the word, "Lugenpressa". He makes references to Nazi Germany like 1933. It's not the media making those statements, it's him. His words.

He thinks white people are superior. "Only white people could build the Sistene Chapel". And various other stupidity. He wants to rid America of minorities. Sure, he has almost no power so can't do it, but that doesn't make his ideology any less reprehensible than those who had enough power to apply the same ideology.

it's amusing that you don't even know the correct word, 'lügenpresse', while trying to present yourself as some kind of authority.

and stuff like his haircut ( ) doesn't make him a nazi. the nazis had a particular political programme (see the 25 points); spencer's is clearly different. a person can be far-right without being a nazi.

[Bereta_Eder]

Also we have to take into account rage.

Rage seems to be directed more efficiently and absorbed into political vehicles.
We see that from songs too.
Most "angry" songs are political in europe whereas in america they seem to be more about blind undirected violence

[Kidlicious]

Good prediction. Of course that just proves my point. And I wasn't saying it was as bad as 9-11.

[Kidlicious]

it's amusing that you don't even know the correct word, 'lügenpresse', while trying to present yourself as some kind of authority.

and stuff like his haircut ( ) doesn't make him a nazi. the nazis had a particular political programme (see the 25 points); spencer's is clearly different. a person can be far-right without being a nazi.

It's basically like saying an Islamist is a terrorist, but he doesn't get it.

[Aeson]

it's amusing that you don't even know the correct word, 'lügenpresse', while trying to present yourself as some kind of authority.

That is a Nazi of a different sort though ..

and stuff like his haircut ( ) doesn't make him a nazi. the nazis had a particular political programme (see the 25 points); spencer's is clearly different. a person can be far-right without being a nazi.

You address each item as if it is in a vacuum, and ignore the picture they are all painting. He is a white supremacist. He thinks the white race is inherently superior to all other inferior races. He thinks that America is a white nation and should rid itself of all non-whites, that America is for whites only. He makes references and allusions to Nazi Germany with "luggenpressa", "let's party like it's 1933", his hair cut, his remarks about how awesome Germany is for being more ethnically pure than America is ... he even welcomes Nazi salutes without batting an eyelash. He dehumanizes various groups, literally questioning that they are people at all. Calling those on the left "soulless golems".

The guy is a Nazi. And you're one the stooges who buys the whole "peaceful ethnic cleansing" line.

[C0ckney]

Maybe (I'm just guessing) cockney judges him in comparison with people with very similar ideology who actually engage in violent acts. Apparently he hasn't yet or at least in apparent fashion.

However, that is not so important in a view that his stance elicits violent action anyway.
Actually it's worse because someone looking like an ape spweing hate and acting violently is easily dismissample but a clear cut "gentleman" setting the foudnations for what can only be accomplished through violent means is more dangerous in getting his message across as something civilized.

Also let us not forget the message of image.

The puncher acted like a cleansing actor, solidifying in deeds what many people are thinking.

What is the image of a nazi when he's whimpering like a **** that he has "Received violence"?


easily dismisample

no, i'm saying that spencer is not a nazi because he isn't one. i think someone calling him a fascist would be on firmer ground, but even then it's debatable. he's basically pushing an american version of nouvelle droite thinking combined with a more overt white nationalism.

i'm afraid that i disagree with the second part. he advocates a separate homeland for 'european americans'. i disagree wholeheartedly with that, but are those ideas really so different from israel or japan, or what the allies did after ww1 to ensure that different peoples had their own homeland, or the anti-colonial movements for the peoples of africa and asia? seems like there are a lot of 'nazis' around in that case. i prefer to oppose ideas like spencer's by calling them what they are and taking them apart via honest debate, not by lying about them and trying to shut him down violently while shouting 'NAZI!'. this approach is not only false, but it is also ineffective, for it will only engender sympathy for him and his views.

a similar thing is happening in europe now with the so-called right-wing populists (many again directly or indirectly influenced by nouvelle droite ideas). much of the response has been to shout 'FASCIST!, NAZI!'. it has been a total failure, and the reason for that is because most people, when they look for themselves, can see the falsity of such claims: 'we've seen this before' is met with 'we've heard it all before'. i think that their ideas are bad and can be beaten through discussion and debate. sadly, many of my colleagues on the left prefer the 'shut it down' approach. we are seeing the results of that now.

[Bereta_Eder]

That is a Nazi of a different sort though ..



You address each item as if it is in a vacuum, and ignore the picture they are all painting. He is a white supremacist. He thinks the white race is inherently superior to all other inferior races. He thinks that America is a white nation and should rid itself of all non-whites, that America is for whites only. He makes references and allusions to Nazi Germany with "luggenpressa", "let's party like it's 1933", his hair cut, his remarks about how awesome Germany is for being more ethnically pure than America is ... he even welcomes Nazi salutes without batting an eyelash. He dehumanizes various groups, literally questioning that they are people at all. Calling those on the left "soulless golems".

The guy is a Nazi. And you're one the stooges who buys the whole "peaceful ethnic cleansing" line.

Another not so subtle reference to nazism is the children of the sun (etc) straight out of paganistic nazi rituals.

[Bereta_Eder]

and trying to shut him down violently while shouting 'NAZI!'. this approach is not only false, but it is also ineffective, for it will only engender sympathy for him and his views.

[

Personally I don't think that anyone will change his opinions about far rightism just because a nazi/far righter got punched.
I don't think the effect is so big .

On the contrary I think that those who do change their opinions are probably young impressionable kids, will rather go with the strong/ notgiving a **** dude than the sissy (using it to describe a situation, not endorsing the word)