So I opened the Koran for the first time and the first verse I read was...

[Aeson]

The interpretation you give to something you've read can be affected by prejudice. I wouldn't expect a Christian to much care for the Koran, but they'll probably like the Bible (if they read it, most won't). It's mainly about conforming to preconceptions.

My own readings of the Bible (as a believer child, and as a skeptic adult) are quite different in what I come away with. When I read the Koran (as a sceptic adult) it reminded me a lot of the OT. I don't remember it as well as the Bible now though, likely since I read the Bible a few times through and it gets a lot more exposure in the circles I've kept online and off. Both were interesting reads even as a sceptic. Both contain an awful lot of absurdities and some truly horrific ideas presented as "good".

[Kidlicious]

The interpretation you give to something you've read can be affected by prejudice. I wouldn't expect a Christian to much care for the Koran, but they'll probably like the Bible (if they read it, most won't). It's mainly about conforming to preconceptions.

My own readings of the Bible (as a believer child, and as a skeptic adult) are quite different in what I come away with. When I read the Koran (as a sceptic adult) it reminded me a lot of the OT. I don't remember it as well as the Bible now though, likely since I read the Bible a few times through and it gets a lot more exposure in the circles I've kept online and off. Both were interesting reads even as a sceptic. Both contain an awful lot of absurdities and some truly horrific ideas presented as "good".

That's why it's stupid to argue that it sounds like mumbo-jumbo, either the Bible or the Koran. But people argue that the Bible sounds like mumbo-jumbo all the time here, and you say nothing. People say Christians do X all the time and you don't call that prejudice. But if anyone says Muslims do X you call that prejudice.

[NICE MOBIUS]

I'm specifically saying that you are prejudiced and hypocritical to blindly accept the writings of the bible while at the same time condemning the Quran - both books are in effect equally absurd and horrific.

Basically you are saying:

"My book on made up unicorns is better than your book on made up unicorns, nyah-nyah-nyah!"

[Ming]

Most religions claim they are the one true religion, and that they believe in the one and only true God.
If there is a God, most of them are wrong

[Kidlicious]

I'm specifically saying that you are prejudiced and hypocritical to blindly accept the writings of the bible while at the same time condemning the Quran - both books are in effect equally absurd and horrific.

Basically you are saying:

"My book on made up unicorns is better than your book on made up unicorns, nyah-nyah-nyah!"

I'm not blindly accepting anything. I've pointed out that the Koran commands men to beat their wives. That's my criticism, not that it's mumbo-jumbo.

[NICE MOBIUS]

Most religions claim they are the one true religion, and that they believe in the one and only true God.
If there is a God, most of them are wrong

Exactly. Even among the religious, the vast majority of them are destined for various versions of eternal damnation just from backing the wrong horse.*









* Who's to say the one true god is not a horse?

[NICE MOBIUS]

I'm not blindly accepting anything. I've pointed out that the Koran commands men to beat their wives. That's my criticism, not that it's mumbo-jumbo.

And I've pointed out that the bible condones gang rape.

You're happy to criticise wife beating, but appear to be silent on the matter of gang rape...

[Kidlicious]

And I've pointed out that the bible condones gang rape.

You're happy to criticise wife beating, but appear to be silent on the matter of gang rape...

Do you even know one Christian that believes the Bible condones gang rape? You are having fun with your straw man and at the same time supporting a religion that is violent towards women.

[NICE MOBIUS]

Earlier, I linked to an entire passage in the bible where it condones rape, you ****ing numpty!!!

[Kidlicious]

Earlier, I linked to an entire passage in the bible where it condones rape, you ****ing numpty!!!

That's funny, because no Christians believe that the Bible condons rape. In fact, you're the only person I know that thinks that. On the other hand a significant number of Muslims believe that the Koran commands men to beat their wives. Feminists alsi believe that, and ao do most non Muslims who have read the Koran.

[Aeson]

That's why it's stupid to argue that it sounds like mumbo-jumbo, either the Bible or the Koran. But people argue that the Bible sounds like mumbo-jumbo all the time here, and you say nothing. People say Christians do X all the time and you don't call that prejudice. But if anyone says Muslims do X you call that prejudice.

If someone thinks the Bible is mumbo jumbo but thinks the Koran is the truth, or thinks the Koran is mumbo jumbo and thinks the Bible is the truth ... then there is likely a prejudice at work. Because qualitatively, they both offer a lot of, "this can't be proven, or even tested, but just trust it's true", and some really ugly displays by the God that's supposed to be good.

If someone says they are both mumbo jumbo, that doesn't necessarily display a prejudice for or against one or the other. It could be a prejudice against religion in general, but that often looks like a sane skepticism. I wouldn't expect anyone who is being exposed to the content of either for the first time to think that the [spiritual/god stuff] is any more factually based than say, midichlorians and the force. Because the level of proof offered for those are all 0.

[rah]

The bible does seem to condone treating women like second class citizens and there are many christians that believe that. You come to mind.

[Kidlicious]

If someone thinks the Bible is mumbo jumbo but thinks the Koran is the truth, or thinks the Koran is mumbo jumbo and thinks the Bible is the truth ... then there is likely a prejudice at work. Because qualitatively, they both offer a lot of, "this can't be proven, or even tested, but just trust it's true", and some really ugly displays by the God that's supposed to be good.

Well dang, why would God want you to trust him. That's totally irrational.

The Bible can be tested. Do what it says and you will find that out. Put your trust in God and he will provide you with wisdom. That's the only way it works. You don't get to do it your way, because your way is inferior.

Now, what I said isn't prejudice at all. It comes from a person who has realized his own limitations, and that of all human beings.

If someone says they are both mumbo jumbo, that doesn't necessarily display a prejudice for or against one or the other. It could be a prejudice against religion in general, but that often looks like a sane skepticism. I wouldn't expect anyone who is being exposed to the content of either for the first time to think that the [spiritual/god stuff] is any more factually based than say, midichlorians and the force. Because the level of proof offered for those are all 0.

Prejudice is not sane skepticism. Does that need explaining?

[Kidlicious]

The bible does seem to condone treating women like second class citizens and there are many christians that believe that. You come to mind.

The Bible doesn't even argue against Christians not being second class citizens. God doesn't care about your social status.

[rah]

Then don't say crap like

Yes, a man is suppose to be the head of the house, but he is suppose to treat his wife so well that his wife has no need for rights.