So how long will Ben last this time?

[Aeson]

Don't forget "chastisement" ...

[Ben Kenobi]

My experience with them? How do you know about my experiences with women? And why would by experiences with women mean that I have an adversarial relationship with them?

Because that's my charism, Kid. Men who feel that they have gotten the short end of the stick tend to harbor resentment.

In words? Yes. Is that a problem for you?

You might as well ask, "why are sunsets beautiful?" Words are inadequate.

Why do you think the Protestant Church is separated from women? That's insane.

Because I was one and they despise Mary. They have bad theology when it comes to her and the position of women within the Church.

But what does their gender have to do with anything?

The fact that I'm saved and will not go to hell because of them? Because of their kindness and support through some difficult periods of my life? Because they would invite me to lunch and tea? Women are not men, and thank God for that.

Good Night! Are women your God?!!

No, but they brought me to Him. And for that I am grateful.

First of all, I don't see the Church serving God.

We are not individuals, Kid. We are members of one Body, serving our Lord. This, again, is bad theology you have picked up.

I see individual Christians serving God. And it doesn't matter what gender they are. Did Christ not say in Heaven there are neither male or female?

Yes, it does matter, Kidicious. We are men because God chose to make us men. Women are women because God chose to make them that way. This, again, is part of the reason why protestants have issues with other parts of their theology, specifically concerning the body and the purpose that God has for us in our lives.

Women are supposed to be women, and you, and your church does not understand the beauty of this.

Besides that I have no idea what you are talking about. You have female all tied up in your religion. I've never seen anything so strange. Of course you will say that you don't worship women. You talk crazy dude.

That you accuse me of 'worshipping women', is what is wrong with your theology. You consider honoring women worshipping them, and we can appreciate them for who they are.

You need to read your Bible, Kid. "He made them male and female".

[Ben Kenobi]

I am sure that most (if not all) of the girls studying today (or being successful in their jobs) would be very unhappy if they would have to quit their study (no higher education for women in the 19th centurey) because boyfriend/husband wouldn´t allow it and if they would only be allowed to have a job, if their husband/boyfriend allowed it (and then usually no higher positions, as jobs with important decision making would bve reserved for men.

Women are not a monolith, Proteus. Sure, some would feel this way, but just because you feel this way is not how all women would feel.

[Ben Kenobi]

Strawman. You claimed that being born outside the US disqualifies someone from being considered "natural born citizen".

So you're suggesting that they reserved natural born people to White people is not a significant concession? They wanted people who had similar languages and similar cultures. Race was a placeholder for this.

The law in 1790 specifically stated that there were cases which being born outside the US still qualified for "natural born citizen".

Among white people, and they traced citizenship through the father, meaning that Cruz would be Cuban. You immediately dismissed the law as 'misogynist and racist', and yet would take part of it without the rest of it. They had a reason for doing what they did, and I think it's significant that they chose to do things this way.

Unsurprisingly you adopt the racist portion of the law to "prove" your point, which has nothing to do with what was actually being discussed.

Mhmm, well I am pretty sure I understand their rationales and it still doesn't get you where you want to go.

While there are plenty of other stupid things that have happened in history, it doesn't excuse your stupidity for wanting an inbred family to rule over everyone.

LOL

Inbred? LOL

[Proteus_MST]

Women are not a monolith, Proteus. Sure, some would feel this way, but just because you feel this way is not how all women would feel.

Which is why I said "most, if not all" instead of "all".
I also limited my prediction to those women who study and/or are successful in their jobs

I have no doubts that there are women who prefer not to study or have a job and instead be 24/7 housewife and/or mother ...
but those woman already have the freedom to do so in our western society and aren´t forced to study or make a career
(and therefore aren´t necessarily included in the number of people that study or are successful in their jobs)

[Ben Kenobi]

Ancestry of James I:

Stuart, Hamilton, Stuart, Sinclair, Douglas, Drummond, Tudor, Plantagenet, Stuart, Oldenburg, Tudor, Plantagenet, Metz, Egmond, Capet, van Limburg

Of his 16 ancestors, 3 were Stuarts, 2 Plantagenets and 2 Tudors.

He is twice related to Mary Tudor (Henry VII's daughter by Elizabeth Plantagenet), once via Archibald Douglas, and once via King James of Scotland.

Of the Stuarts, all three are different branches, one is the royal line, two are subsidiary lines, and they are very different from each other.

So out to his great grandparents, he has one overlap, Mary Tudor. That is all. His consanguinity is around 12.5 percent.

[Ben Kenobi]

I have no doubts that there are women who prefer not to study or have a job and instead be 24/7 housewife and/or mother ...
but those woman already have the freedom to do so in our western society and aren´t forced to study or make a career
(and therefore aren´t necessarily included in the number of people that study or are successful in their jobs)

Given the taxation regime of most European countries and the fact that their husband would be subsidizing childcare for those who choose to work, I would argue otherwise. European countries are very hostile tax wise to women staying at home.

[Proteus_MST]

Given the taxation regime of most European countries and the fact that their husband would be subsidizing childcare for those who choose to work, I would argue otherwise. European countries are very hostile tax wise to women staying at home.

Can´t agree with this, at least for germany, where thanks to tax reduction for married couples, it is very viable if one of them stays at home ...
also, according to statistics, 47 % of the mothers in germany with at least one child younger than 6 years are stay at home mothers without a job ... in france it is still 41%.
Which is a higher percentage than within the USA, where it is just 37%
(although one should add that, at least for germany, thanks to minimum wages and other legal regulations, it probably also is much more economic viable to live with just one paycheck, than it is the case for the USA)

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hausfrau

[NICE MOBIUS]

I think I've seen it all:

Kid's misogyny is so bad that even Ben is jumping in to defend women's rights against him!

[Ben Kenobi]

47 % of the mothers in germany with at least one child younger than 6 years are stay at home mothers without a job

I'm surprised it's that high. If it's 47 percent, I'd argue that's pretty solid evidence that many women want to stay at home.

[NICE MOBIUS]

Normal service is resumed.

[Proteus_MST]

I'm surprised it's that high. If it's 47 percent, I'd argue that's pretty solid evidence that many women want to stay at home.

Many of the stay at home moms will resume their jobs later when the kid goes to school.

It just makes most sense during the first year of the life of a child, when a child needs most of the care, for one of the couple, sto stay at home.
Escpecially as, in germany, it is hard work to get a place in a daycare center (which would be a necessity if both would want to work full time, despite the kid). I would guess that the percentage of stay at home moms (with a child between 0 and 6 years) in the USA also would rise, if there were more regulations (like minimum wages and tax cuts) that would make it economically viable for one of the couple to stay at home.

Also one should add that the decision alone, to get a kid, already means a certain commitment to a family (unless the conception happened "by accident", of course)
To add another percentage:
20% of women in germany, between 40 and 44 years, have no children

Which seems to be a clear indication that those women prefer(ed) career over raising a family

[Ben Kenobi]

Funny that Mobius considers women who stay at home 'misogynist.'

[Egbert]

Can a woman be a misogynist?

I guess so. seems odd though.

Now my head hurts.

[NICE MOBIUS]

Yes, your head hurts because Ben is making stuff up as usual.

Funny that Mobius considers women who stay at home 'misogynist.'

Funny how I said absolutely nothing of the sort.

However you said that 'many women want to stay at home' as a blanket statement. The implication I draw from that is that you think that women in general would prefer to be housewives. Proteus picked up on it, pointing out that many of these mothers will resume their jobs.

At least your sexism towards women is less strident than Kid's, but it's still there.

It would be interesting to see what the stats are for UK mothers, seeing as for the longest time the majority of nursery care was left up to market forces and therefore exorbitantly expensive.