What is the deal with Mary, the mother of Jesus, with Catholics.

[MrFun]

Because the artists preferred it that way.

GASP! Creative license!?

[Elok]

But when we start caring about how his mother got pregnant, I feel his message got lost.

We care about that sort of thing because part of Christ's message was about who He is, i.e. God. Christianity cannot be made into a simple philosophy devoid of the supernatural without doing violence to the teachings of Jesus Himself. You're leaving out the Jesus of the Last Judgment, the Jesus risen from the dead, the Jesus who cast out demons, the Jesus transfigured on the mountain, the Jesus who spoke of the Holy Spirit, etc.

This is not to denigrate His humanity, but He was more than a simple moral teacher.

[C0ckney]

yeah i mean really that's the difference between those who believe he was the son of god and those who believe he was a radical jewish preacher with some groovy ideas.

[The Mad Monk]

GASP! Creative license!?

Yes, creative license. Hard to avoid without original documentation.

[Proteus_MST]

We care about that sort of thing because part of Christ's message was about who He is, i.e. God. Christianity cannot be made into a simple philosophy devoid of the supernatural without doing violence to the teachings of Jesus Himself. You're leaving out the Jesus of the Last Judgment, the Jesus risen from the dead, the Jesus who cast out demons, the Jesus transfigured on the mountain, the Jesus who spoke of the Holy Spirit, etc.

This is not to denigrate His humanity, but He was more than a simple moral teacher.

AFAIK early christianity was rather divided on the Status of jesus, just as it was divided on the holy trinity.
AFAIK there were lots of people who believed him to be "just" a prophet (before his status got fixed at the first council in the 4th century (as well as the status of trinity) ... and everyone who believed otherwise got persecuted and their scriptures burned).

But nowadays of course, (almost) all of christianity is united in the belief that Jesus was divine and part of the trinity

[Ben Kenobi]

AFAIK early christianity was rather divided on the Status of jesus, just as it was divided on the holy trinity.
AFAIK there were lots of people who believed him to be "just" a prophet (before his status got fixed at the first council in the 4th century (as well as the status of trinity) ... and everyone who believed otherwise got persecuted and their scriptures burned).

Umm, the Arians did plenty of persecutions. They eventually lost, but it wasn't for lack of support from the Emperor.

[Kidlicious]

Umm, the Arians did plenty of persecutions. They eventually lost, but it wasn't for lack of support from the Emperor.

Troll

[Jon Miller]

AFAIK early christianity was rather divided on the Status of jesus, just as it was divided on the holy trinity.
AFAIK there were lots of people who believed him to be "just" a prophet (before his status got fixed at the first council in the 4th century (as well as the status of trinity) ... and everyone who believed otherwise got persecuted and their scriptures burned).

But nowadays of course, (almost) all of christianity is united in the belief that Jesus was divine and part of the trinity

Can you name christian elders before 150 AD who thought that Jesus was just a prophet?

JM
(I am not doubting that there were any, I am doubting that you know any; I think that you have no basis for your statement "AFAIK there were lots of people who believed him to be "just" a prophet (before his status got fixed at the first council in the 4th century" other than wish. My experience is that people who say things like this have generally not done any study and have nothing else they are going on then wish and maybe a Dan Brown novel.)

[MrFun]

Yes, creative license. Hard to avoid without original documentation.

How much original documentation does one need, to verify that there'd be no need for belly buttons and umbilical cords for Adam and Eve, if God had created the first two human beings?

[The Mad Monk]

[Kidlicious]

[Bereta_Eder]

the Jesus who cast out demons, the Jesus transfigured on the mountain, the Jesus who spoke of the Holy Spirit, etc.

the only time I managed to "piss off" my italian catholic friend was when asking him in a very mocking manner if he believed in the existence of evil as an autonomous/independent entity.


(reply: yes in the form of 1.90 tall greek coglione )

[Bereta_Eder]

How much original documentation does one need, to verify that there'd be no need for belly buttons and umbilical cords for Adam and Eve, if God had created the first two human beings?

From clay?

Does the bible at least say that?

Because god could just have given birth (and be a woman)

[giblets]

From clay?

Does the bible at least say that?

Because god could just have given birth (and be a woman)

Genesis 2:7

[Berzerker]

Yes

that means god made us sinners and then punished us for it

Actually, Christ is the second Adam, so there's the understanding that Christ, like Adam is like how we should have always been.

who is the 2nd Eve?