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  • Sometimes I don't know if HC writes for the National Review or reads it

    The world is abuzz with news that actor Laverne Cox has become the first transgender person to appear on the cover of Time magazine. If I understand the current state of the ever-shifting ethic and…


    The world is abuzz with news that actor Laverne Cox has become the first transgender person to appear on the cover of Time magazine. If I understand the current state of the ever-shifting ethic and rhetoric of transgenderism, that is not quite true: Bradley Manning, whom we are expected now to call Chelsea, beat Cox to the punch by some time. Manning’s announcement of his intention to begin living his life as a woman and to undergo so-called sex-reassignment surgery came after Time’s story, but, given that we are expected to defer to all subjective experience in the matter of gender identity, it could not possibly be the case that Manning is a transgendered person today but was not at the time of the Time cover simply because Time was unaware of the fact, unless the issuance of a press release is now a critical step in the evolutionary process.As I wrote at the time of the Manning announcement, Bradley Manning is not a woman. Neither is Laverne Cox.
    Cox, a fine actor, has become a spokesman — no doubt he would object to the term — for trans people, whose characteristics may include a wide variety of self-conceptions and physical traits. Katie Couric famously asked him about whether he had undergone surgical alteration, and he rejected the question as invasive, though what counts as invasive when you are being interviewed by Katie Couric about features of your sexual identity is open to interpretation. Couric was roundly denounced for the question and for using “transgenders” as a noun, and God help her if she had misdeployed a pronoun, which is now considered practically a hate crime.

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    The phenomenon of the transgendered person is a thoroughly modern one, not in the sense that such conditions did not exist in the past — Cassius Dio relates a horrifying tale of an attempted sex-change operation — but because we in the 21st century have regressed to a very primitive understanding of reality, namely the sympathetic magic described by James George Frazer inThe Golden Bough. The obsession with policing language on the theory that language mystically shapes reality is itself ancient — see the Old Testament — and sympathetic magic proceeds along similar lines, using imitation and related techniques as a means of controlling reality. The most famous example of this is the voodoo doll. If an effigy can be made sufficiently like the reality it is intended to represent, then it becomes, for the mystical purposes at hand, a reality in its own right. The infinite malleability of the postmodern idea of “gender,” as opposed to the stubborn concreteness of sex, is precisely the reason the concept was invented. For all of the high-academic theory attached to the question, it is simply a mystical exercise in rearranging words to rearrange reality. Facebook now has a few score options for describing one’s gender or sex, and no doubt they will soon match the number of names for the Almighty in one of the old mystery cults.Regardless of the question of whether he has had his genitals amputated, Cox is not a woman, but an effigy of a woman. Sex is a biological reality, and it is not subordinate to subjective impressions, no matter how intense those impressions are, how sincerely they are held, or how painful they make facing the biological facts of life. No hormone injection or surgical mutilation is sufficient to change that.
    Genital amputation and mutilation is the extreme expression of the phenomenon, but it is hardly outside the mainstream of contemporary medical practice. The trans self-conception, if the autobiographical literature is any guide, is partly a feeling that one should be living one’s life as a member of the opposite sex and partly a delusion that one is in fact a member of the opposite sex at some level of reality that transcends the biological facts in question. There are many possible therapeutic responses to that condition, but the offer to amputate healthy organs in the service of a delusional tendency is the moral equivalent of meeting a man who believes he is Jesus and inquiring as to whether his insurance plan covers crucifixion.
    This seems to me a very different sort of phenomenon from simple homosexuality (though, for the record, I believe that our neat little categories of sexual orientation are yet another substitution of the conceptual for the actual, human sexual behavior being more complex and varied than the rhetoric of sexual orientation can accommodate). The question of the status of gay people interacts with politics to the extent that it in some cases challenges existing family law, but homosexual acts as such seem to me a matter that is obviously, and almost by definition, private. The mass delusion that we are inculcating on the question of transgendered people is a different sort of matter, to the extent that it would impose on society at large an obligation — possibly a legal obligation under civil-rights law, one that already is emerging — to treat delusion as fact, or at the very least to agree to make subjective impressions superordinate to biological fact in matters both public and private.
    As a matter of government, I have little or no desire to police how Cox or any other man or woman conducts his or her personal life. But having a culture organized around the elevation of unreality over reality in the service of Eros, who is a sometimes savage god, is not only irrational but antirational. Cox’s situation gave him an intensely unhappy childhood and led to an eventual suicide attempt, and his story demands our sympathy; times being what they are, we might even offer our indulgence. But neither of those should be allowed to overwhelm the facts, which are not subject to our feelings, however sincere or well intended.
    "I hope I get to punch you in the face one day" - MRT144, Imran Siddiqui
    'I'm fairly certain that a ban on me punching you in the face is not a "right" worth respecting." - loinburger

  • #2
    I never understood the idea that gender is a social construct. If it were, where did it come from and why is it so universal in human cultures? It did not come from on high because there is no god. Did it spring forth from the mind of some exceptional individuals who propagated it across so many cultures?

    Gender has a genetic basis. Our 'gender roles' are an extended cultural phenotype, but still derive directly from genetics. They might be the product of the majority of dichotomous gender individuals who millennia ago formulated and sustained and continue to sustain the gender roles, but gender is not a social construct, unless you accept a very weak interpretation of social construction.
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    • #3
      If HC wrote articles like that I'd be inclined to agree with him more often.
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      • #4
        Originally posted by Al B. Sure! View Post
        I never understood the idea that gender is a social construct. If it were, where did it come from and why is it so universal in human cultures? It did not come from on high because there is no god. Did it spring forth from the mind of some exceptional individuals who propagated it across so many cultures?

        Gender has a genetic basis. Our 'gender roles' are an extended cultural phenotype, but still derive directly from genetics. They might be the product of the majority of dichotomous gender individuals who millennia ago formulated and sustained and continue to sustain the gender roles, but gender is not a social construct, unless you accept a very weak interpretation of social construction.
        The application of gender as a discriminating factor in how society treats people absolutely is a social construct. There's nothing in a woman's DNA that says they can't drive and yet they're categorically discriminated against on the basis of such literally and jokingly. To me, its not a question of whether someone is or isn't female but how we treat women - the biological component is only a sticky wicket for people that wish to disassemble and trash any divergence from their preconceived schema of how things should be.

        Your question of where did gender roles come from and laying it all at the feet of genetics seems to ignore the various ways women and trans issues are treated across a plethora of societies throughout history. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fa'afafine

        I know that you're a bit pith helmet and reductionist but are somoans so different genetically that this is just the way it is or is the society fashioned in such a way to make this identity acceptable?
        "I hope I get to punch you in the face one day" - MRT144, Imran Siddiqui
        'I'm fairly certain that a ban on me punching you in the face is not a "right" worth respecting." - loinburger

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Al B. Sure! View Post
          I never understood the idea that gender is a social construct. If it were, where did it come from and why is it so universal in human cultures? It did not come from on high because there is no god. Did it spring forth from the mind of some exceptional individuals who propagated it across so many cultures?

          Gender has a genetic basis. Our 'gender roles' are an extended cultural phenotype, but still derive directly from genetics. They might be the product of the majority of dichotomous gender individuals who millennia ago formulated and sustained and continue to sustain the gender roles, but gender is not a social construct, unless you accept a very weak interpretation of social construction.
          Gender roles are largely (but not entirely) the same across different cultures, but the expression of gender is most certainly not. You only have to look at changing rules of fashion to see that. It goes beyond even fashion, however. There are cultures where women are supposed to be the stern ones and men the emotional ones. Yadda yadda.
          Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
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          • #6
            The application of gender as a discriminating factor in how society treats people absolutely is a social construct.
            Uh, no it isn't. I hate to break it to you, but men and women are different and these differences do have a physical reality to them.

            There's nothing in a woman's DNA that says they can't drive and yet they're categorically discriminated against on the basis of such literally and jokingly. To me, its not a question of whether someone is or isn't female but how we treat women - the biological component is only a sticky wicket for people that wish to disassemble and trash any divergence from their preconceived schema of how things should be.
            Yeah, and I'm sure it's just a coincidence that women have children. Sorry, not buying this crap. You know when Albert and I agree on something, it's probably true that you are wrong.
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            • #7
              I like how we've progressed from HC's threads *****ing about a stranger's sex change to our threads *****ing about his *****ing. The logical next step is clear.
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              • #8
                Originally posted by Lorizael View Post
                Gender roles are largely (but not entirely) the same across different cultures, but the expression of gender is most certainly not. You only have to look at changing rules of fashion to see that. It goes beyond even fashion, however. There are cultures where women are supposed to be the stern ones and men the emotional ones. Yadda yadda.
                Let me put it a little more simply. Whether or not you have a Y chromosome, and consequently whether or not you have a penis, is not a social construct.

                That author has it spot on.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Elok View Post
                  I like how we've progressed from HC's threads *****ing about a stranger's sex change to our threads *****ing about his *****ing. The logical next step is clear.
                  Oh, itll happen
                  "I hope I get to punch you in the face one day" - MRT144, Imran Siddiqui
                  'I'm fairly certain that a ban on me punching you in the face is not a "right" worth respecting." - loinburger

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by regexcellent View Post
                    Let me put it a little more simply. Whether or not you have a Y chromosome, and consequently whether or not you have a penis, is not a social construct.

                    That author has it spot on.
                    I thought we were talking about gender, not biological sex.
                    Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
                    "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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                    • #11
                      I know you disagree, but they are the same thing.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by regexcellent View Post
                        Let me put it a little more simply. Whether or not you have a Y chromosome, and consequently whether or not you have a penis, is not a social construct.

                        That author has it spot on.
                        Also, having a Y chromosome is necessary but not sufficient for having a penis. I'm guessing you didn't read the article I posted in the last thread about this stuff discussing that even biological sex is more complicated than a single binary.
                        Click here if you're having trouble sleeping.
                        "We confess our little faults to persuade people that we have no large ones." - François de La Rochefoucauld

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by regexcellent View Post
                          I know you disagree, but they are the same thing.
                          And if they aren't?
                          "I hope I get to punch you in the face one day" - MRT144, Imran Siddiqui
                          'I'm fairly certain that a ban on me punching you in the face is not a "right" worth respecting." - loinburger

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                          • #14
                            Surprise, you found a guy who writes for a conservative magazine that largely agrees with me! Mind blown

                            FYI I read this article a week ago and thought it was pretty spot on
                            If there is no sound in space, how come you can hear the lasers?
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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Lorizael View Post
                              Also, having a Y chromosome is necessary but not sufficient for having a penis. I'm guessing you didn't read the article I posted in the last thread about this stuff discussing that even biological sex is more complicated than a single binary.
                              Words cannot describe my disinterest in very rare corner case genetic diseases.

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