Ben Kenobi vs Michael the Great

[molly bloom]

Dude, how much is your hearing actually impaired?

Not nearly as much as his cognitive and empathic abilities if he's really serious about comparing the lot of the deaf, profoundly deaf or hearing impaired with that of people of African descent in the post-Civil War era:

Afro-American leaders well understood white willingness to use violence as a means to gain their end. R.R. Wright Jr., a leading black social worker and social philosopher who was editor of 'The Christian Recorder', reacted to the fact that, from 1890-1917, a black man or woman had been lynched on the average of one every TWO DAYS.

" We are lynched, we are hanged, riddled with bullets, and burned. Excursions are run to have the daughters and sons of 'respectable leading citizens' witness the barbecuing of a ******."

quoted in 'The Collapse of Nineteenth Century Culture' in 'The Free And The Unfree- A New History Of The United States' by Carroll & Noble

I'll forego the illustration, but as the man's words imply, these instructive killings were treated as family outings by 'good Christian white folk' and souvenir postcards of the ritual would be sold alongside lemonade and snacks.

Sounds just delightful.

[molly bloom]

I rest my case - the evils of segregation is that it stripped black people of opportunity, of access to a quality education.

Actually it kept them out of white society. It kept them out of government, it kept them out of jobs, it kept them out of areas predominantly inhabited by whites, it forced them to pay higher rents for lower standard accommodation...

Segregation is not humiliating but a benefit, and ought to be so regarded by you gentlemen.

Woodrow Wilson's remarkable response to African American objections to the establishment of Jim Crow segregation in the Federal Civil Service. So African Americans were suitable for fighting for the U.S. in Cuba, the Philippines or Europe in WWI, but using the same lavatories or eating facilities as white Americans ?

The horror.


Not sure if these were segregated or not, but they were in existence (unbelievably) until the 1950s:




and after your delicious repast, what better than a post-prandial cigarette ?

[molly bloom]

What laws are there to require that deaf children be taught to read? There aren't any.

So neither Canada nor the United States has the equivalent of :

[Compulsory education was also extended to blind and deaf children under] the Elementary Education (Blind and Deaf Children) Act of 1893, which established special schools. Similar provision was made for physically-impaired children in the Elementary Education (Defective and Epileptic Children) Act of 1899.

http://www.parliament.uk/about/living-heritage/transformingsociety/livinglearning/school/overview/1870educationact/

Before then the Church or individual initiative was the provider:

In Britain, initiatives were less systematic. Five years after L'Épée had opened his school, the first deaf school was opened in Britain by Thomas Braidwood (1715-1806). The school was in Edinburgh and in 1760 initially accepted one deaf pupil. Braidwood’s success in teaching speech to this boy led to numbers increasing to twenty pupils by 1780. His approach, due to the use of natural gesture, was known as ‘combined’ rather than being the pure oralism used elsewhere in Germany and most parts of Europe. Many visitors were impressed by the school and Braidwood’s reputation was widespread.

The Braidwood family in many ways represented deaf education for nearly half a century, however Thomas Braidwood was keen to keep his precise teaching methods secret, allegedly to avoid competition. The school in Edinburgh was eventually closed and Braidwood opened a new school in London in 1783. This school became known as Old Kent Road Asylum for the Deaf and Dumb, with Braidwood’s nephew, Watson becoming the new Head. Three years after Thomas Braidwood’s death, Watson, published a book ‘Instruction of the Deaf and Dumb’(1809) which described their methods of education.

http://www.bris.ac.uk/Depts/DeafStudiesTeaching/deafed/Session%202A.htm

The reason I'm interested in the history and provision of education for those with hearing impairment is because I have a friend with progressive hearing loss and my partner contracted viral labyrinthitis which totally destroyed the auditory nerve in one of his ears, leaving him with severe tinnitus and affecting his balance.

[molly bloom]

What the hell else is this 'deaf' culture bull**** that leaves deaf students trapped in their own ****.

Perhaps other people who were deaf or had hearing impairments didn't like your company. I can see why...

Despite the mighty efforts of generations of oralists, deaf people still prefer to communicate and mingle with their own kind. That is the psychosocial basis of Deaf culture. Deaf people in the United States have staunchly resisted the unstinting attempts of oralists to eradicate the use of sign language and assimilate them into the hearing mainstream. The simple fact is that deaf people who attend the common residential schools for the deaf—no matter what mode of communication is forced on them in the classroom—tend to seek out other deaf people and communicate in sign language. This is true, to some extent, in other countries, but the U.S. arguably has the most sophisticated and creative—and public—Deaf culture of any.

Note that “Deaf culture” is a positive term, indicative of pride and a communal identity, whereas terms like “hearing-impaired” and “deafness” do not connote any particular pride or sense of community. There are oralists (deaf as well as hearing) who deny that there is such a thing as Deaf culture. They prefer to see it as an artificial political construct formulated in recent times, more of a self-conscious, posturing attitude than a reality. This view denies the importance of ASL to Deaf people.

http://www.deafculture.com/definitions/

I'm reliably informed by those who grew up using sign language that they can tell someone who has learned sign language but isn't actually deaf, by their body language. I have another friend who teaches mathematics to children who are deaf, but this clip from the BBC series 'See Hear' shows a trainee drama teacher who is deaf :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0169czn

Note this too:

37/38 The status of British Sign Language ten years after its official recognition as a language

[molly bloom]

Maybe I could get really offensive

'Could get' ? Too late, Mr. Self Pity Party .

If I wasn't angry about the sexual abuse of deaf children in a school for the deaf why did I bring it up?

Gee, so you'd try and get some sympathy ?

I notice you didn't claim YOU had been raped, and in any case, many children worldwide who weren't deaf or had any other significant disability were also abused in schools and youth camps and children's homes run by the Roman Catholic Church. Perhaps it wasn't the hearing impairment that was significant, but the religion...

[Dinner]

.

[Ben Kenobi]

No. I'm saying just because they read at a 5th grade level doesn't mean there is anything wrong with their school dip****.

Kidicious apparently believes deaf = dumb.

[kentonio]

It's like you're the only deaf person he's ever met..

[MichaeltheGreat]

Looks like someone set himself up for that one.

[Kidlicious]

Good burn kentonio, but he's not the only deaf person that I know. I actually have some experience teaching deaf students. It is hard to teach someone that can't hear. That doesn't mean they are dumb. Only BK is dumb, and he's a bit of an ass as well.

[Alexander's Horse]

As I said earlier, if it ain't got Catholic in the name, you ain't interested.

er IIRC I think Ming was raised catholic, he knows the church from the inside better than you

[Nikolai]

er IIRC I think Ming was raised catholic, he knows the church from the inside better than you

Hitler was raised catholic...

[Alexander's Horse]

I'm going to have to invoke the "if you mention Hitler you lose the argument" rule

[Nikolai]

Hehe... Is that so.

[Ben Kenobi]

It is hard to teach someone that can't hear. That doesn't mean they are dumb.

So just because it's hard means that the teachers should accept piss poor results?